Over the past year I have been swiping labels on merchandise to buy cheaper at a national known franchise and returning them at a later date for more money. When I return the item for a gift card the policy is to take your license number down – so they have me in their records.
The other day a lady employee ran up and took the return guys receipt then called for someone (whom I would presume is store security). I was able to leave, but the lady employee just glared at me. I think once they go through my records they will be able to piece together my thievery.
I think I stole around $10000 to $15000 over this year long-time period.
Would they have this all on camera?
Is this considered Retail Fraud in the first or second degree?
I am married with two young children, a 10 month old and 2.5 year old. It all came crashing down on me how much it would destroy my family if I am convicted and have to serve jail time.
Should I wait to hear from the store or an indictment or…
Should I contact a defense lawyer now? If so, what action should I take?
Thank you.
Big Time Retail Fraud
Printable View
-
08-22-2006, 11:40 AMneedamiracle1000Big Time Retail Fraud
-
08-22-2006, 10:15 PMPaulERe: Big Time Retail Fraud
With your estimate of the dollar value and having done it for an extended period, once the store looks into it you will be in big trouble. It's safe to say you've hit the Felony Fraud mark in most any state and if the store is somewhat up to date in customer surveillance you won't be hard to find. How long ago was your last visit and what state are you in?
-
08-23-2006, 06:12 AMneedamiracle1000Re: Big Time Retail Fraud
I am in Pennslyvania. What are the Felony Fraud mark penalties.
Is there any way i can find out if I am being investigated? Could I try to pay restituiton with the retailer before this goes to court? -
08-23-2006, 02:13 PMbam!Re: Big Time Retail Fraud
If you really feel bad, look up the corporate address, have a lawyer help you write a letter and start paying it back.
Or, you can send a letter to a store's loss prevention office, explain that you want to rectify yourself of this wrong, and here is some money.
Or, just send money orders to the store's loss prevention office with no explaination other than "restitution".
You are on the right track of rectifying your mistakes. You obviously are in anguish over this and need to put it behind you. I have had people send me letters, emails, and notes with money/payment for the exact situation you are in (not to the extent or dollar amount you have though).
Trust me, you want to resolve this on your terms, because the outcome will be better. If they stop you in the store, do not sign any papers, or incriminate yourself, just request representation.
Resolve this matter, go on your way and try not to do this anymore.
Oh, and $15,000 is definately a felony in PA. -
08-23-2006, 03:45 PMsouperdaveRe: Big Time Retail Fraud
Let me preface my remarks with "NO!, I am not having a bad day!"
Each and every time you perpetrated this activity you went way above and way beyond the simple shoplifter. You took a series of concious steps to commit fraud. And not only once or twice, but quite a few times. Emphasis on quite!!!
And each and every day when you went home to your wife and kids it never once dawned on your loser mentality that your "world could come crashing down on you" at any given second???
NO! Not until you got confronted with the VERY real possibility that your tail could be in a sling. SO now a river of tears the size of Niagra starts ONLY because you stand a VERY real chance of seeing some bigtime legal difficulty over this. MULTIPLE counts of refund fraud, or defrauding a retailer, or whatever they call it in your neck of the woods. We're talking major felonies slim.
Isn't it amazing how your hindsight is VERY acutely 20/20 at this point???
All I can say is one more thing; your are damned lucky I am not the one on your case! I would put in a herculean effort to see that you got the biggest legal "gun" I could aim in your direction and "pull the trigger"! You made your situation what it is.......I would do all I could to see that all you gained from it was stripped from you.......
Ye maketh ye bed, theneth ye lie!
Have a nice day. Sleep well. (one more thing, most warrants are served in the pre-dawn hours) -
08-23-2006, 03:50 PMsouperdaveRe: Big Time Retail Fraud
Ya know, looking back at my last post some may say I was a bit harsh. Logical readers will possibly see me for what I am...a realist!
Besides, ya want sugar coating? Try KrispyKreme! -
08-23-2006, 05:03 PMBlueCrystalRe: Big Time Retail FraudGo get 'em Dave! I agree with you on this. I won't cry any tears for any con or rip off artist.Quote:
Quoting souperdave
-
08-24-2006, 08:55 AMneedamiracle1000Re: Big Time Retail Fraud
Yes, I am aware that I am a loser and deserve what I get! However, I am not sure my family deserves to pay for my mistakes, which they will when I lose my job, then the subsequent loss of our house and so forth.
What is the process most LPs will follow? Will they send me a letter that I am under invesigation first since I was not caught on the premise? .Or will I just be indicted? Will this be a federal charge?
Do most stores' LP agree to a restitution settlement where I can pay back the monetary amount stolen and as long as I do not frequent the store again they will not press charges? -
08-24-2006, 09:52 AMbam!Re: Big Time Retail Fraud
Its all about company policy. I seriously doubt you will lose your job if you have a decent attorney and make a plea agreement. That of course is assuming that you are identified by the local police and prosecuted by the DA.
LP's cannot decide by themself if they will take payment and just drop the case, they must go through their district manager, legal etc and work through the chain of command to resolve this fraud case. -
08-24-2006, 11:20 AMrmet4nzkxRe: Big Time Retail Fraud
Are you able to cover the $15k and any punitive costs? Don't expect them to take a payment plan. I suggest you go and retain a criminal defense attorney.
-
08-24-2006, 11:27 AMneedamiracle1000the entire 15K
No I am not able to cover the entire 15K. I am scheduled to see a criminal defense lawyer tomorrow.
How long do you think it will take before someone contacts me about this? This incident occurred last friday and I have not heard anything so far.
My guess is that they are puttung all the pieces together and will wait until they have a good case against me, and then off to the grand jury for the indcitment. -
08-24-2006, 11:28 AMneedamiracle1000Re: Big Time Retail Fraud
No I am not able to cover the entire 15K. I am scheduled to see a criminal defense lawyer tomorrow.
How long do you think it will take before someone contacts me about this? This incident occurred last friday and I have not heard anything so far.
My guess is that they are puttung all the pieces together and will wait until they have a good case against me, and then off to the grand jury for the indcitment. -
08-24-2006, 11:44 AMrmet4nzkxRe: the entire 15KYou will need more than $15k + your attorney, they are just getting their charges together figuring out how much you defrauded them out of, I'm sorry but do you realize just how lacking in intelligence that was? Does your spouse know?Quote:
Quoting needamiracle1000
-
08-24-2006, 02:48 PMbam!Re: Big Time Retail Fraud
I personally think that you are going to be fine. The store workers probably got suspicious, but don't have enough communication to put everything together - (unless you did everything at the exact same store, the exact same way).
I have been working loss prevention for a long time, store level, district level and beyond. A lot of time, store workers will "bust" someone, but besides passing it onto store LP - the case goes nowhere.
A company most likely will take payment plans. Think about employee theft - do you really think that the employee pays back the ENTIRE amount at the time of confession or sentencing? I have seen low and high dollar busts take years to pay off - think of it as a credit card balance, you make payments and the balance goes down - you don't, fees tack on and the balance goes up.
If I was in miracles position, I would set up a meeting with a store manager, district loss prevention manager or store director and come clean. Stores are not in the business of locking people up - they are in the business of remaining profitable for shareholders and employees.
I would hazard a bet that most of the store directors/managers/loss prevention would take a restitution in a heart beat - it adds to their bottom line.
Miracle, get this off your shoulders, rectify it and do the right thing - pay back what you can and of course consult a lawyer before signing any papers.
You will be fine - people have been in your position before and come out alive, just learn from your mistakes and determine not to repeat them. -
08-24-2006, 11:22 PMPaulERe: Big Time Retail Fraud
I can't share your view on this Bam, I think most stores WILL follow through with the big hammer. It's not a casual ho hum deal that would be swept under the rug like you suggest, it's a major Felony crime. I've had cases that start off looking pretty good then when you dig more and see how involved and high priced it is, not only does it take a few weeks but you don't want to let it go so easily. I'm not sure stepping forward with restitution and letters is a good idea either, if....mind you "IF" they are on to the crime they'll close the door till the investigation is done. "IF" they don't know diddley-squat about Mr. Scammer, your peeing into the wind. I'm not saying miracle shouldn't feel like crap for putting his life, family and reputation on the line but why kick a sleeping LP....I mean dog. (lame humor...it's late)
-
08-25-2006, 06:41 AMneedamiracle1000Re: Big Time Retail Fraud
Basically the criminal defense lawyer I meet with this morning suggested that I sit and wait it out. The lawyer seemed to imply that the only way they can prove my return fraud is by having me on video or if an employee vouches that they have seen me return the wrong item numerous times? The reason being, once the non-damaged merchandise is returned and placed back on the shelf it just becomes part of the merchandise again. Then you can say that is what you bought and returned.
So in general, how long does most LP keep surveillance video stored for? A week, month, or year? -
08-25-2006, 06:51 AMrmet4nzkxRe: Big Time Retail Fraud
It can vary from store to store. What did the attorney tell you to do insofar as returning to that store for any reason?
How much did your consultation cost? -
08-25-2006, 09:22 AMneedamiracle1000Re: Big Time Retail Fraud
So what would the average video storage time be in your opinion?
Oh, $100 is how much she charged.
Anyway I am leaning towards the restituition. I just think it is the right thing to do instead of seating around waiting for the boom to fall. -
08-25-2006, 09:31 AMHappy TrailsRe: Big Time Retail FraudSo you would like to go to the store and admit to a felony and pay restitution than listen to your lawyer?Quote:
Quoting needamiracle1000
You do realize that admitting guilt and offering to make it right does not mean that criminal charges won't be filed. -
08-25-2006, 12:08 PMbam!Re: Big Time Retail FraudI am not saying it would be swept under a rug or even ignored. Miracle has a better chance of avoiding prosecution (if the store even knows about it) by coming clean. It is easier to ask forgiveness than permission.Quote:
Quoting PaulE
One more thing, who is to say that miracle even performed the transactions in question - unless they have clear video or acurate eyewitness accounts, them just typing her ID number into the database means nothing. I would say they would have to bust her on the spot making a fraudulent return and then tack on the previous amounts as charges subsequent to busted fraud. (At least that is how Target would do it).
I think Miracle is ok as far as the retail company goes, but she needs to clear her own head regarding the amounts owed. -
08-25-2006, 12:40 PMneedamiracle1000Re: Big Time Retail Fraud
Let me recap what happened the other day.
I was returning the merchandise for a higher amount. While making the return the clerk noticed that the price of the item was incorrect on the merchandise. At that point I had to agree with him. The return clerk asked the manager for a void. The manager voided the item. The correct price was entered along with my license #. I signed the receipt and got a gift card (actually for the correct dollar amount).
At that exact point this other lady (who looked like a cashier) came swooping in behind the manager and the return clerk and asked (then grabbed) the receipt right out of the return clerk’s hand. She ran to her register and paged some guy – probably store LP. I proceeded to leave the store. On my way out she had the receipt in hand and glared at me – I guess whoever she paged was busy.
Now they have me on video trying to push this item to the return cashier. Is that not incriminating enough? What would LP’s next steps be when they arrived to get the receipt from this lady cashier? -
08-25-2006, 11:19 PMPaulERe: Big Time Retail Fraud
If the 'lady' who grabbed the receipt could convince the LP to dig into it and if he felt like it was worth the time and effort of looking into, all things considered a case could be made. You may feel like clearing the air and getting this off your back, but why go looking for trouble? If the store is going to put a case together.....let them. If they don't then you dodged a huge bullet, just my opinion....I'd stay clear of the store no matter what happens.
-
09-02-2006, 03:19 PMtravelplusRe: Big Time Retail Fraud
Hate to say this but if it were my store I would be on your case so quickly you can't even say your name. I would be so upset someone is trying to decieve us and make us lose money. Think about how much rent the store pays,the cost of employees,insurance etc. I would keep a close eye on the cameras. What you are doing is so criminal and it's not fair to the honest customers(me included) that we have to pay more for a product because you get the lower price.
Owe up to it and I wish you all the best but you need to learn a lesson. I won't cry tears if you go to jail because you set yourself up for it. You did it more than once and you are deceiving your family. Don't show your kids or family that it's right to lie or change price tags on items. -
09-02-2006, 05:15 PMsouperdaveRe: Big Time Retail FraudSince when did you change professions travelplus? Couldn't have been more than 30 or 40 minutes ago!Quote:
Quoting travelplus
And since when did you become "the honest customer"? My guess on that would be 30 to 40 seconds ago.....
Scaredin... you're already in enough of a fix. Do a little research on this site as to what "travelplus" has posted about. Most likely he's posting from the common room during freetime at the county lock-up!
Do whatever it takes to make a complete and total 180 Scaredin.. !
Travelp.....I'll see ya next time at the door when I'm puttin' cuffs on ya....
Y'all have a nice evenin'. -
09-02-2006, 06:28 PMcissycicleRe: Big Time Retail FraudSouperdave, how bout taking those handcuffs over to the banter board? This sounds like it could be fun being "cuffed"!Quote:
Quoting souperdave
-
09-03-2006, 10:18 AMsouperdaveRe: Big Time Retail Fraud
Me no think the wife would approve.......
Besides, I taught her how to shoot years ago. AND, she knows the combo to the gunsafe......:( -
09-09-2006, 02:07 PMTraumaFromTargetRe: Big Time Retail Fraud
I find this story very hard to believe. I've worked for several department stores and at those you could only make 3 to 5 returns a year per drivers license number without a receipt. I remember trying to return something at Target without a receipt years ago, and when they punched in my license number they told me I had exceeded the allowable limit for returns without a receipt.
Like Bam! said, the store LP has to go through several avenues to be able to pursue charges. Then after that, enough evidence has to be presented to a police detective to take on the case, and it usually has to be very concrete.
I'm not sure I would do what Bam says here. Every store is different as far as how managment handles things. A store manager at one store might appreciate your honesty and work with you, but another store manager might really take it personally and want to prosecute you.
Most stores in a case like this will alert all the employees to be on the look for you. They would prefer to catch you in the act and try to coherse you into confessing for what you have been doing.
Another thing you need to do is go see a psychiatrist so they can diagnose what you are suffering from. My guess is that its some kind of obsessive/compulsive disorder. In case you do get brought up on charges, your defense lawyer can show you've been getting treatment for your illness. -
09-10-2006, 09:43 PMbam!Re: Big Time Retail Fraud
Trauma is right, you are taking a gamble by going back into the store and coming clean. You were also taking a gamble by perpetrating the fraud in the first place.
What happened in this case? How long has it been and what has occured since your last post?
This is an interesting thread, even though I think I know how it will play out if it is "Real" in the first place. -
11-13-2006, 12:45 AMelliottdelilahRe: Big Time Retail Fraud
I think that if the man wanted criticism for his actions, he'd look in the mirror. He is looking neither for sympathy, nor condonation. He needs help. Please help him with legal advice, or just write to someone else who is in need for moral high horses. Please.