My question involves a child custody case from the State of: Ohio
Last night my children's mother came over when I wasn't home and rummaged through the house looking for personal items. I asked her not to come in uninvited and she said that since she still gets mail delivered there * that she is a "resident" and can do that. Is that true? That doesn't make sense. I get mail for people I've never met, are they "residents" too?! BTW, I'm the custodial parent.
Additionally, we were never married, she doesn't have a key [I know of]. I'm renting the house. She hasn't lived there for 18 months and our custody papers indicate her new residence. She does have some personal items in the basement that I've asked her to pick up but she has not, basically using my space as storage. I suppose I could charge her for that if she doesn't comply. Another question, are those items still hers? Can I throw them out? I've asked her to pick them and and will again letting her know that if she doesn't I will remove them. Her name never was on the lease or ultility bills. I'm not sure if it's listed on her DL. TIA
* She doesn't get all of her mail delivered to our home but yes, ocassionally she might get some junk mail. I suppose I should give that to her when she drops off the kids on her weekends.
Mother of My Children Comes into Home Uninvited
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10-29-2010, 06:14 AMSonatinaMother of My Children Comes into Home Uninvited
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10-29-2010, 08:04 AMNdK1009Re: Mother of My Children Comes into Home Uninvited
First of all, I think that you should very clearly explain to her that she is not to enter your house. Period. (unless her visitation with her children is supervised in your home). Tell her that if she enters your home without your consent, that you will call the police. You have every right to call the cops the next time that she does it and ask that they charge her with trespassing or breaking-and-entering. Your home is not her residence. And because you are renting, any damage that she might do is your responsibility. No! She cannot simply walk into your home whenever she pleases. If you are able to, you should probably change your locks and make unauthorized entry as difficult for her as possible. This act will also help your case for criminal charges. But make sure your landlord is aware of the key change, if your lease dictates anything about his/her ability to enter the property.
As for her stuff, send her written notice that she has 15 days (or whatever amount your comfortable with) to arrange a time with you and to collect her items. If she does not collect her things by the end of that time, tell her that you will dispose of them (or donate them, etc.). Technically, you don't have to give her an opportuinty to collect her stuff. She moved out and essentially abandoned that stuff. This last chance that I am advising is an act of kindness.
As for her mail, I'd stop collecting it. Write "Not at this address, Return to sender" on it and hand it back to the post office. If it's junkmail that says "or current resident", then you can call the business and ask to have your address removed from their mailing lists. -
10-29-2010, 08:26 AMcyjeffRe: Mother of My Children Comes into Home Uninvited
How old are the children and who was watching them in your absence? Why weren't you there?
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10-29-2010, 08:34 AMNdK1009Re: Mother of My Children Comes into Home Uninvited
Good point, Cyjeff. I made the assumption that the house was empty when she entered. But regardless of whether or not the children and a gf or abysitter was there with the kids, so long as th op is the only one listed on the lease, then anyone entering the residence without his knowledge or permission is entering illegally, right?
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10-29-2010, 08:37 AMcyjeffRe: Mother of My Children Comes into Home UninvitedThat is, at face value, confusing to the point of being incorrect.Quote:
Quoting NdK1009
She still owns the stuff. You cannot dispose of it or donate it without her prior approval (hopefully, in writing). It is not an act of kindness but, instead, the law.
As for the access to the house, I agree that she does not have a right to be there... unless, of course, the children that were left in control of the home allowed her entry. -
10-29-2010, 08:55 AMNdK1009Re: Mother of My Children Comes into Home UninvitedOkay, I'm going to display my legal ignorance here, but please tell me which Ohio statute states that an ex-boyfriend has to store the property his ex left behind when she moved out. As I understand the op, there is no written contract stating that he would turn a portion of his house into a warehouse.Quote:
Quoting cyjeff
And how is this situation different from if she had put her belongings in a storage facility and then just left the stuff there? The facility has the legal right to confiscate and dispose of unclaimed/abandoned property, why doesn't the BF have the same right. I'm afraid I don't see how this is much differnt than dealing with the property I found when I moved into my new home. The previous residents left quite a bit behind. I'm not obligated to keep it for them. So why is the op required to keep his ex's stuff in this instance?
As long as he gives her an oportuinty to collect her possesions, in writing, then I believe he would be within his rights to do whatever he chooses with those items after that collection period has expired.
But I'm willing to be proven wrong. -
10-29-2010, 09:23 AMSonatinaRe: Mother of My Children Comes into Home Uninvited
Our children are 7 and 8, their 13 YO half brother was watching them. He is CRT certified and attended baby sitting classes through Children's hospital. He watches them after school when I drop them off @ home for an hour. He answered the door and let her in. When he told me she was rummaging through out the house I emailed her and asked her not to come in uninvited and that's where she said she could because she's still a "resident". I'm not trying to be a jerk, heck I've let her use my space this long, my concern is being a nice guy I've giving her an excuse to gain access to my home. So, she's been put on notice not to do so again. Stepping inside to get out of the weather is one thing, rummaging through out the house is another. I get a lot of bill collectors calling for her and have tried to get my number off their list, same with mail. She seems to think I'm holding her mail when in fact the only thing she gets now is junk mail. Thanks.
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10-29-2010, 10:28 AMcyjeffRe: Mother of My Children Comes into Home UninvitedBecause, in the case of a storage unit, the contract for use specifically states how items left behind will be disposed, the time frames involved and the resultant storage charges if any. In other words, it is different because there is no contract here and, therefore, no way to enforce the breach of that contract.Quote:
Quoting NdK1009
The way to handle it is to create a contract between the parties by stating, in writing, that the items will be stored for X days without charge and then a charge will be incurred and/or disposal of those items. I have also recommended, on occasion, the additional step of the OP moving the items himself to a storage facility, paying for a, say, 3 month lease, securing the items with a combination lock and then providing the owner the location of the items, a copy of the contract and the combination to the lock... all in writing. In this way, he is no longer in possession of the items.
This further reduces the liability upon the OP if the items are lost or damaged while in his care. Because there has, most likely, not been any sort of inventory and, therefore, the ex can state that all kinds of items were lost, destroyed or damaged.
As to what was left behind by the previous residents, you, actually, could have been financially liable for those items. Further, you also exposed yourself to possible criminal actions when you destroyed them. You lucked out... the previous residents really did abandon the items.... but your processes were NOT legal.
I think we are both saying the same thing about notification. I wanted to make it clear that written processes and notification are not kindness but, instead, the proper legal method of resolving the issue.
When you left your 13 YO child in possession of the house, he had the legal authority to grant access to that home.Quote:
Quoting Sonatina
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10-29-2010, 10:31 AMaardvarcRe: Mother of My Children Comes into Home UninvitedThere's not one. There was no contract between the two, but courts typically rule in such cases that REASONABLE notice must be given BEFORE the items can be disposed.Quote:
Quoting NdK1009
(a) because a warehouse GETS a contract, that spells out specific deadlines AND lays out what happens when the deadlines aren't met, and (b) more importantly, she was never a RESIDENT at the warehouseQuote:
And how is this situation different from if she had put her belongings in a storage facility and then just left the stuff there?
Because she was a co-resident with him. He can absolutely dispose of her stuff, realizing that doing so without notice acceptable by the court opens him to liability. 18 months is pretty much universally way too long for her to claim she was "coming right back for it". But the crux of the issue will be him saying she hasn't lived there in 18 months, and her saying, or showing SOME form of documenation to the court that would indicate otherwise. Him putting the demand for removal in writing cements the dates and protects HIS backside from a counter suit.Quote:
The previous residents left quite a bit behind. I'm not obligated to keep it for them. So why is the op required to keep his ex's stuff in this instance?
Exactly. Which is why that's what he needs to do.Quote:
As long as he gives her an oportuinty to collect her possesions, in writing, then I believe he would be within his rights to do whatever he chooses with those items after that collection period has expired.
Further agree with Jeff...once the 13 year old LET her in, all claims of illegal entry or burglary went right out the window. If it can be proven that she took items that were NOT hers, there MIGHT be a basis for a larceny charge - but experience suggests that police, without having any way to know WHOSE items they were, since their property was still co-mingled, will refer him to the civil courts to prove both that HE and only he was the owner of such property, and that she was the one who took it. -
10-29-2010, 10:37 AMSonatinaRe: Mother of My Children Comes into Home UninvitedAnd or deny access in the future?Quote:
When you left your 13 YO child in possession of the house, he had the legal authority to grant access to that home.
Thank you for the suggestions. I will give her written notice and set a deadline to either remove her possessions or I will have them disposed.