Entering a Child's Life After Twelve Year Absence

My question involves a child custody case from the State of: KS

Here's my situation and it's a doozy (but whose isn't?):
In 1998 when I was 21 I had a son. My name is on the birth certificate. I've paid child support and had him on my medical, dental, and vision since he was born. However, I haven't seen him since he was probably less than two weeks old. It's not that I didn't want to, I didn't know how since his mother and I didn't end on the best of terms. Plus, she never really offered it to me.

Here's my background - I'm not a criminal or drug user or anything like that. After we broke up I went on to get a garden variety 9-5 job, got married, and now have a house in the suburbs. In other words, there's no reason anyone, much less a judge, would say I'm a bad influence.

Last summer my family had a baby explosion (I'm one of four boys) and now my wife and I have five nephews and one niece. Seeing them started tugging at my heart and then in late November my father passed. That pushed me over the edge and something in the last week or so has stirred me to try and get involved with his life. I decided it wasn't fair to deny him knowing his father, my nephews and niece from not knowing their cousin, and more importantly my widowed mother from not knowing her first grandchild.

I'm late to the party but him to end up resenting me. Again, aside from the neglect, which is a biggie, there isn't anything that would cause someone to call me a bad influence. White collar job, live in the burbs, go to Mass every Sunday, involved in Boy Scouts, currently working towards a bachelor degree...

Here's the meat - my ex-girlfriend has every single reason to hate me. Is there hope that we'd be able to work something out without having to get the courts involved? I'm also concerned about the neighborhood she lives in. I don't think it's trashy per se but I have reason to believe he might be better off going to school in our neighborhood (I think he's homeschooled right now, which I am NOT crazy about at all). I hate to think that I show up 12 years late and then say "I don't want him to be homeschooled. He's going to get a good education and if that means he has to live with us then I'll make it happen." I mean she's done all the work and then I just rip him out the only home he's known? Seems kind of cold hearted to me. Anyway, thoughts?

Court orders protect ALL of you. Court orders are your friend :)

File to establish visitation. You have virtually no chance of physical custody, but you'll get a graduated visitation plan.

This means you'll get short visits, probably supervised, until you and your son get to know each other.

At this point I doubt you'd get any kind of legal custody; Mom seems to be doing fine.

And please don't go into court saying "Mom didn't offer me any visitation" - the judge will likely raise an eyebrow and say "...you had every change of filing for visitation yourself. Don't go blaming Mom".

Know what I mean?

You can try talking to your ex- about how you might meet the child, when that might occur, whether it would be appropriate to involve a psychologist in any meeting or reconciliation, etc.

If you expect to enter the child's life and start dictating what you believe to be proper child care, or express concern about a neighborhood that has not previously concerned you enough to say a word, well, the time to have tried that was twelve years ago. If you believe you can take custody, dictate the child's school, or otherwise upset his life because the idea of being a daddy is suddenly tugging at your heartstrings, I suggest you get a more realistic sense of what you can expect after a dozen years of intentional absence from your child's life. If you want this to be amenable, you need to keep some opinions and desires to yourself.

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Quoting Dogmatique

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Court orders protect ALL of you. Court orders are your friend :)

File to establish visitation. You have virtually no chance of physical custody, but you'll get a graduated visitation plan.

This means you'll get short visits, probably supervised, until you and your son get to know each other.

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Give her a heads up first right? Don't just have someone show up?

And I just read somewhere else that therapy would probably be a good supervised visit. Not only would we get to know each other but we can work out any underlying abandonment issues and it wouldn't be quite so awkward. In other words we'd be encouraged (read: forced) to talk to each other. I'm not sure that it'd be ok, but I know I'd like my wife to go, kind of a security blanket for me. Who knows, maybe he hates shrinks as much as me! (My parents made me go when I was around 6 or 8 - there was nothing I hated more than telling some stranger how I felt.)

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Quoting Dogmatique

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At this point I doubt you'd get any kind of legal custody; Mom seems to be doing fine.

And please don't go into court saying "Mom didn't offer me any visitation" - the judge will likely raise an eyebrow and say "...you had every change of filing for visitation yourself. Don't go blaming Mom".

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I don't know that she's "doing fine", I'm not saying she's a drug user or anything like that, as a matter of fact I'm sure it's a very loving environment. I'm just worried about the location. My wife and I could've moved that way but instead went the other direction, specifically because it was cleaner and nicer.

And yes, hear you loud and clear. When I say I didn't know how, I meant I was young and didn't know how to handle myself. I've said it before and I'll say it again, it's unfair for me to say I was too young and not ready, she's only a year or two older than me, she was in the same boat, she just chose to ride it out to sea while I chickened out (not completely I guess, I did pay CS and medical insurance-not cheap, he was a premie) and went back to shore.

It probably goes without saying that I'm also scared to death about what she's told him about me. I like to think that I'm a good guy, except for ignoring my son. That whole concept has nearly brought me to tears the last week or so. Anyway, I'll save it for therapy. :)

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Quoting Mr. Knowitall

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You can try talking to your ex- about how you might meet the child, when that might occur, whether it would be appropriate to involve a psychologist in any meeting or reconciliation, etc.

If you expect to enter the child's life and start dictating what you believe to be proper child care, or express concern about a neighborhood that has not previously concerned you enough to say a word, well, the time to have tried that was twelve years ago. If you believe you can take custody, dictate the child's school, or otherwise upset his life because the idea of being a daddy is suddenly tugging at your heartstrings, I suggest you get a more realistic sense of what you can expect after a dozen years of intentional absence from your child's life. If you want this to be amenable, you need to keep some opinions and desires to yourself.

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I don't plan to go in screaming for changes, more like discussions on what's best for him. And it certainly won't be right away. That would come once we all get acclimated to the situation. Now if she does throw that in my face constantly, which I kind of expect, then there really isn't much I can come back with.

Therapy is a great idea but I can pretty much guarantee that you won't be initiating it; at the moment Mom is the only one who can make legal decisions like that.

Leave your wife out of it for now. It's going to be hard enough for kiddo to get used to you being around, and Mom may feel quite threatened by a stepparent suddenly coming into the realm of visitation.

Remember, stepparents need to not stay out of the picture completely, but stay on the sidelines.

There is a chance that the court won't allow you visitation at all. A small chance. "Best interest of the child" is the standard, and if it's felt that this disruption would be harmful, it's not going to happen.

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Quoting Dogmatique

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Therapy is a great idea but I can pretty much guarantee that you won't be initiating it; at the moment Mom is the only one who can make legal decisions like that.

Leave your wife out of it for now. It's going to be hard enough for kiddo to get used to you being around, and Mom may feel quite threatened by a stepparent suddenly coming into the realm of visitation.

Remember, stepparents need to not stay out of the picture completely, but stay on the sidelines.

There is a chance that the court won't allow you visitation at all. A small chance. "Best interest of the child" is the standard, and if it's felt that this disruption would be harmful, it's not going to happen.

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Hopefully she's matured too, and will agree with me that it's a good idea to have an objective mediator there to discuss what all is on our minds. And thinking about it a little more, it probably would be slightly uncomfortable for me, as well as everyone else, to talk about it there, with my son and ex on one side and my wife on the other.

If the court says it's a bad idea, then I can at least say I tried (doesn't mean I agree), and he'll know that I made the effort, albeit very late. And when he's 16 or 18 maybe he'll want to give it a shot (I can cross my fingers).

Quick question.

Has Mom remarried? Has she been living with someone who may be the father figure?

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Quoting Dogmatique

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Quick question.

Has Mom remarried? Has she been living with someone who may be the father figure?

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Not married and not that I know of.

Ok, well that at least takes the idea of a stepfather/figure out of the equation.


Now, this bit is probably going to seem harsh. But you need to hear it, so put on your big boy pants, sit down and listen.


You need to adopt a different mindset. You're still in the "I hope she sees it my way" train of thought and you need to let that go - like yesterday.

Because at this point, you need to be seeing it her way, not vice versa. You have to understand that you have been completely and utterly AWOL for 12 years. Why should she even entertain your opinion? You haven't made any effort to see your son. You've made no effort to be involved in his life.

Yet here you are, talking about what you think should happen, how you think she should react....you see where I'm going here?

This isn't about you. At all. It really isn't.

In very simple terms, you need to be kissing her butt and praying that she'll talk to you. THEN you need to be praying that the court will entertain any petition for visitation and custody.

But more importantly, you need to be forgetting about yourself and focusing on what's honestly in your son's best interest. No more of this boohooing about how you haven't been around and last year was so hard and everyone had babies and oh my god now you feel like being a father. How the heck do you think your son has felt all of these years?

He needed a father 12 years ago.

If you want to step up to the plate, good for you. But realize that you're not going to be doing it on your terms.

At all.

(see now? That wasn't that bad, was it? You're still standing, right? :) )

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Quoting Dogmatique

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Ok, well that at least takes the idea of a stepfather/figure out of the equation.


Now, this bit is probably going to seem harsh. But you need to hear it, so put on your big boy pants, sit down and listen.


You need to adopt a different mindset. You're still in the "I hope she sees it my way" train of thought and you need to let that go - like yesterday.

Because at this point, you need to be seeing it her way, not vice versa. You have to understand that you have been completely and utterly AWOL for 12 years. Why should she even entertain your opinion? You haven't made any effort to see your son. You've made no effort to be involved in his life.

Yet here you are, talking about what you think should happen, how you think she should react....you see where I'm going here?

This isn't about you. At all. It really isn't.

In very simple terms, you need to be kissing her butt and praying that she'll talk to you. THEN you need to be praying that the court will entertain any petition for visitation and custody.

But more importantly, you need to be forgetting about yourself and focusing on what's honestly in your son's best interest. No more of this boohooing about how you haven't been around and last year was so hard and everyone had babies and oh my god now you feel like being a father. How the heck do you think your son has felt all of these years?

He needed a father 12 years ago.

If you want to step up to the plate, good for you. But realize that you're not going to be doing it on your terms.

At all.

(see now? That wasn't that bad, was it? You're still standing, right? :) )

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I agree 100% with you, and like I said, it's all contingent upon her giving me the time of day. I *totally* recognize that fact.

But you would suggest trying to contact her first and then going through the court system? Regardless of how it's done it'll be a complete curveball out of the blue, but what's the gentlest way?

Yes, contact the mother first. I guarantee that if the first the mother hears from you is through papers served to her by the sheriff, it will NOT be pretty. Talk to her alone, without the child, and see how receptive she is to allowing you into the child's life. Make sure you ask HER what SHE thinks is the best way to go about it, and reiterate the fact that you want to do what's best for the CHILD. Leave YOUR thoughts and emotions out of it. If you want Mom to work with you, then like pp said, you really need to kiss her butt and give HER all of the power (which she really has anyway). The hardest part is going to be convincing her that you are not going to just disappear out of the child's life again once you are a part of it. This will be Mom's biggest concern - the WORST thing you could do for the child would be to enter his life and then exit again.

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Quoting sillystring

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Yes, contact the mother first. I guarantee that if the first thing mother hears from you is through papers served to her by the sheriff, it will NOT be pretty. Talk to her alone, without the child, and see how receptive she is to allowing you into the child's life. Make sure you ask HER what SHE thinks is the best way to go about it, and reiterate the fact that you want to do what's best for the CHILD. Leave YOUR thoughts and emotions out of it. If you want Mom to work with you, then like pp said, you really need to kiss her butt and give HER all of the power (which she really has anyway). The hardest part is going to be convincing her that you are not going to just disappear out of the child's life again once you are a part of it. This will be Mom's biggest concern - the WORST thing you could do for the child would be to enter his life and then exit again.

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Right right. This is kind of going from legal advice to general advice...but anyway. I was originally going to call, ask her to meet me somewhere like a coffee shop, but some folks suggested email or letter with my phone number, so that way the ball is in her court. If I hear nothing after a month I'd send another letter, and maybe do it one or two more times after that (3 or 4 total). It would be at that point, after hearing nothing back, I wasn't sure if I should then use the courts.

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Quoting JHwkinKS

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I don't plan to go in screaming for changes, more like discussions on what's best for him.

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A little bit of real life advice. I'm going to suggest you do ANYTHING but this...

I've BTDT and I can tell you the conversation that came from it was nothing nice. How DARE you come suggesting "what's best for him" when you don't even KNOW him and haven't seen him since before he's even held his own bottle???? You're asking for trouble and her to get SUPER DEFENSIVE if you go that route. You need to keep the conversation to one akin to touching bases with your childhood best friend that you haven't seen in 20 years.

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Quoting CourtClerk

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A little bit of real life advice. I'm going to suggest you do ANYTHING but this...

I've BTDT and I can tell you the conversation that came from it was nothing nice. How DARE you come suggesting "what's best for him" when you don't even KNOW him and haven't seen him since before he's even held his own bottle???? You're asking for trouble and her to get SUPER DEFENSIVE if you go that route. You need to keep the conversation to one akin to touching bases with your childhood best friend that you haven't seen in 20 years.

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So when you say you've experienced this do you mean you knew, was absent, then tried to get in contact?

I've talked with a friend of mine who's kind of the authority on child custody (he's always fighting for his) and he thinks my phone call will be welcome. I don't know that I share his optimism but it's definitely a morale booster.

Frankly I think your friend is telling you what he thinks you want to hear.

I agree with Dog. 'Nuff said on my part.

Concur with CC, Doggie and Mom.

Frankly, I'd be PISSED if the father of my child was absent for twelve years, leaving me to fend for myself and my son, then waltzed in after all of the hardest work was done with some lame excuse about "not knowing" how to help take care of the child, and thinking he was going to "express concern" about "what's best for him" and start making changes.

Nothing I would say to him is repeatable in polite company. Except perhaps "Drop dead."

You have absolutely no idea about what's best for someone you don't even know. Donating half the kid's genetic material might make you the father, but it doesn't make you Dad. Dad is the guy who rocks the child at 4AM to try to soothe his colic, not the one who runs away for twelve years, and comes back later with a boo-hoo tale and wants to make himself feel better.

Your friend is doing you a terrible disservice, but try not to be too mad at him when things are not sunshine, rainbows and unicorns. He's just trying to make you feel better about your inaction.

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I hate to think that I show up 12 years late and then say "I don't want him to be homeschooled. He's going to get a good education and if that means he has to live with us then I'll make it happen." I mean she's done all the work and then I just rip him out the only home he's known? Seems kind of cold hearted to me. Anyway, thoughts?

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I think the judge will tell you that you're an ass, and laugh you out of his courtroom for even THINKING that your little fantasy will come to pass. You haven't a leg to stand on.

You need to get with the Reality Program, bub. Your role in the child's life is not that of decision maker. Right now, you are no one to him. Custody is right out. You need to tell Mom "Look, I've been a child. I want to help support our son and get to know him. I'm sorry." Then you get to take what the court allows you to have - and at this late stage, it's not going to be much more than supervised, graduated visitation.

Thanks LRM for being so eloquent. I wrote and rewrote a response, and finally decided that there was no way that I could respond without a whole lotta 'tude on my part.

To the OP, honestly, reread the responses you've gotten before talking to mom. Your initial contact will set the path for everything going forward. Might want to rethink the comments from your friend, cause I can guarantee you that your contact, interjected with what you think is best for a child that you don't even know is NOT going to be appreciated.

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Thanks LRM for being so eloquent. I wrote and rewrote a response, and finally decided that there was no way that I could respond without a whole lotta 'tude on my part.

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I dunno about eloquent, Mom, but I thank you all the same.

I really haven't any patience for genetic material donors who disappear for years on end, then think they're just going to stomp back in, pursue custody, and magically get what they want so they'll feel better about themselves and get to wear the (unearned) title of Mumsy/Daddy.

It's not about the best interests of the child at that point, it's about assuaging one's own guilty conscience, and I just think that's a load of horsepuckey. Thankfully for the kids with such sorry excuses for "parents", the courts agree.

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Quoting JHwkinKS

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So when you say you've experienced this do you mean you knew, was absent, then tried to get in contact?

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No, I mean I was the mother of the child who had the absent father who popped up 10 years later and then wanted to be superdad....

Thanks for all the advice. A few things are running through my mind. I get all the venom and hatred that's out there for guys like me, but the fact of the matter is that I'm deeply concerned for his well being. I'll be the first to admit that I should have exhibited that starting 12 years ago and it's on me to deal with that. I never said that I was going to change his life upside down. If I did it was misunderstood.

This is where it's clear I'm in the minority. There are guys out there that say they want to get reconnected and then 3 months later are gone. That isn't me at all. I have nothing but true remorse for what I've done and what I've put him through. Unfortunately, for his sake, I can't turn back the clock but I can make his future a good one. And I am *very aware* that it won't happen overnight. It's going to be a long process, and lot of counseling, I'm sure. I believe the hardest part will be communicating with his mother.

All I want is to speak with him every day that I can and let him know that he can count on me. To let him know that his father was a schmuck for 12 years but a day hasn't gone by where I didn't think about him in some regard. Simply put, *no one* on this Earth knows exactly how another is feeling, regardless of experience.

As far as getting in touch with her though, I'm running into a problem. I tried calling yesterday and the number has been disconnected. I tried calling KPC and the court trustee, neither of them would give any info, which I expected. My last resort is SRS and the gal who has me send her the insurance cards which she in turn passes on to his mother. I'm thinking it's a safe assumption that she won't be able to give it to me. At that point, the options are facebook, and if that seems like a bad idea (which I really do) then I'll beg the lawyer I meet with to let me talk to her (after he gets her info) before papers go out.

As much as I think that you are in the wrong for bailing out, facebook allows private messages to be sent, as does myspace, if she has accounts. Many contacts are made in this manner. Honestly, don't count on the hardest part being communicating with mom. At 12, you may find that communicating with him after all these years is difficult. You are going to ask him to accept you as a parent, when in fact, he has no clue who you are, and may not for many years.

If you have indeed been paying child support, the local child support enforcement agency should have a recent address for her, which may be available to an atty working on your behalf to contact your ex.

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Quoting mamabear2102003

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If you have indeed been paying child support, the local child support enforcement agency should have a recent address for her, which may be available to an atty working on your behalf to contact your ex.

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Wrong again. CSE doesn't go giving out information all willy nilly... even if you are an atty.

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Quoting JHwkinKS

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All I want is to speak with him every day that I can and let him know that he can count on me. To let him know that his father was a schmuck for 12 years but a day hasn't gone by where I didn't think about him in some regard. Simply put, *no one* on this Earth knows exactly how another is feeling, regardless of experience.

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But here's the thing. He cannot count on you. He has never been able to count on you. Ever. It's lip service. If you're sincere, you'll do the right thing BY HIM - not by you.

If that means not having contact, so be it.

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As far as getting in touch with her though, I'm running into a problem. I tried calling yesterday and the number has been disconnected. I tried calling KPC and the court trustee, neither of them would give any info, which I expected. My last resort is SRS and the gal who has me send her the insurance cards which she in turn passes on to his mother. I'm thinking it's a safe assumption that she won't be able to give it to me. At that point, the options are facebook, and if that seems like a bad idea (which I really do) then I'll beg the lawyer I meet with to let me talk to her (after he gets her info) before papers go out.

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The attorney can't make Mom talk to you or even acknowledge your existence.