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Chances of Winning a DUI Jury Trial

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  • 06-14-2010, 12:19 AM
    vampiria
    Chances of Winning a DUI Jury Trial
    My question involves criminal law for the state of: CA

    2 days ago I have stopped by highway patrol. They took me out of the car and they said they have been following me for 2 miles. I'm sure I didn't do anyting wrong while I was driving, and they didn't tell me the reason to stop. I was scared, and paniced, I couldn't answer their questions very well. I couldn't walk on a straight line with my shaking knees. I had the breathalyzer, and they took me to jail. I had another breath test at the station. Neither the cops stopped me nor the ones at the station told me the results.
    the next day when I get out I saw .17 BAC on my prisoner's receipt.
    I know the exact amount of alcohol I had that night. I had 3 whiskeys on the rocks served by my friend. we took the same glass and measured the amount it takes. Me, my friend, and every other person partied with us that night is %100 sure that I had 7oz. of regular Jack Danels. I'm 180 pounds, 5.10 tall, and I started drinking at 10:30 pm, I have stopped at 2am, and I have taken to jail at 3am.
    I tried every single BAC estimators available online and they all estimate my BAC was .08 at arrest time and .07 at jail time.
    This is my first DUI charge, I have clean traffic and criminal record. I'm a responsible person, I always stop drinking after 2-3 drinks if I have to drive. Maybe at the time they stopped me my BAC .08, and I would understand if it was a little bit over, but I know it was not .17.
    After talking to every attorney in my area I'm thinking to hire Dr. DUI (Mr. Okorocha) to take my case to a jury trial. He doesn't promise me a dismiss, but he says that there is obviously something wrong, and he will go all the way to prove my innocence. If he wins he will deserve every penny I'll pay him. but if he looses in total I will have to pay at leaset 3 times more than if had said 'plead guilty'.
    I have to decide very soon, and I don't know what to do. is there anybody experienced enough to give me an advice?
  • 06-14-2010, 12:40 AM
    aaron
    Re: Chances of Winning a DUI Jury Trial
    You say that you had a PBT at the roadside and a breath test at the station - both showed 0.17?
  • 06-14-2010, 12:57 AM
    vampiria
    Re: Chances of Winning a DUI Jury Trial
    .17 is written on my prisoners receipt. I don't know anyting else because neither the cops stopped me nor the cops at the station told me the the results, and I didn't ask.
  • 06-14-2010, 01:33 AM
    PattyPA
    Re: Chances of Winning a DUI Jury Trial
    I sat on a DUI jury once. Guilty.
  • 06-14-2010, 02:03 AM
    vampiria
    Re: Chances of Winning a DUI Jury Trial
    any details about your case? was it anything close to mine?
  • 06-14-2010, 11:04 AM
    cdwjava
    Re: Chances of Winning a DUI Jury Trial
    The odds of you prevailing on an argument that the machines were wrong is slim to none. Where most DUIs are beaten (in the rare instances they ARE beaten) is on the stop. If there is a lack of reasonable suspicion for the detention and contact, the rest of it goes away. However, this is very rare. Then, they try to fight the officer's capability to adequately perform the FST evaluation and thus form probable cause to make the arrest and obtain the test. When both those fail, then comes the very expensive battle of the experts and these rarely work and are very expensive. You are going to have to pay for an expert or experts to march in and challenge the maintenance and the accuracy of the device used to test your breath or blood.

    The chances of you convincing a jury that you only had enough alcohol to give you a .08 as compared to .17 is slim to none. Now, that being said, if the state thinks this is going to be a long, tough case to make, they might offer you a deal to drop the aggravated factor of the high BAC. It's not much, but it might be something.

    But, hey, if you have the money and it is worth the money to roll the dice and attempt to beat the rap, then go for it.
  • 06-14-2010, 11:47 AM
    vampiria
    Re: Chances of Winning a DUI Jury Trial
    Thank you for the information. I think you're right, sucsess stories are written only on lawyers' websites. I was looking to hear from a real person, and it looks like there is none. Ill just say plead guilty for a crime I didn't commit.
  • 06-14-2010, 11:55 AM
    PattyPA
    Re: Chances of Winning a DUI Jury Trial
    We're real people. :wallbang:
  • 06-14-2010, 12:02 PM
    cdwjava
    Re: Chances of Winning a DUI Jury Trial
    Quote:

    Quoting vampiria
    View Post
    Thank you for the information. I think you're right, sucsess stories are written only on lawyers' websites. I was looking to hear from a real person, and it looks like there is none. Ill just say plead guilty for a crime I didn't commit.

    Now, I did not say that, but, the odds of the machine being incorrect are slim to none. You may not have intended to drive DUI, but it is apparent that you did so. A decent attorney can likely minimize the impact through a plea deal, and there is always the SLIM possibility that there is a problem with the maintenance or the calibration of the device used for the test depending on the device used. An attorney can help leverage any possible errors into a plea deal if that is where you want to go.

    Also understand that online calculators do not account for all aspects of alcohol absorption. They can't. We all absorb alcohol differently and at different rates depending on metabolism, food consumption, gender, body fat, etc. They also do not take into account when the alcohol was consumed in the calculation and generally assume an even distribution of alcohol over the time period you enter. In reality, most people do not drink evenly - they often drink heavily at the beginning or the end, and if at the end, then their BAC can rise quickly, but it drops at an even, relatively steady rate no matter what and this purge level is most often at about .015 per hour.

    Many people also underestimate their alcohol consumption as one of the first things to go when you consume alcohol is judgement. There was research done some years back that indicated that many people that drink socially underestimate how much they have consumed by as much as 50%. That is not always true, but most of us tend to downplay or underestimate our consumption for an assortment of reasons, including fuzzy or unreliable memory.

    In any event, you should certainly consult an attorney about your options.
  • 06-14-2010, 12:28 PM
    cbg
    Re: Chances of Winning a DUI Jury Trial
    Quote:

    Quoting vampiria
    View Post
    Thank you for the information. I think you're right, sucsess stories are written only on lawyers' websites. I was looking to hear from a real person, and it looks like there is none. Ill just say plead guilty for a crime I didn't commit.

    Who do you think is answering if not real people? Robots?
  • 06-14-2010, 12:56 PM
    vampiria
    Re: Chances of Winning a DUI Jury Trial
    Sir, I asked a question and you gave your answer, thank you so much. But please don't try to convince me that I had more alcohol than I remember like the cops did on the field. To have .17 after 4 hours an average person should drink half a bottle. Same bottle is still there containing more than half and I wasn't the only one drinking whiskey that night. I have witnesses too, but I know they are not legal evidence. It's only my word against a high-tech breathalyzer. Chances of winning is slim to none.
    Now I'm a criminal, potential murderer, right. But I can still speak my mind:

    Whoever reading this; if you ever asked for a breath test
    NEVER EVER BLOW ANY BREATHALYZER!!!!!!! Go for the blood test.

    Quote:

    Quoting cbg
    View Post
    Who do you think is answering if not real people? Robots?

    I mean I'm looking to hear a 'success story' from a real person. And there is none.
  • 06-14-2010, 01:03 PM
    mamabear2102003
    Re: Chances of Winning a DUI Jury Trial
    Uh, what size was that bottle??? You don't have to be an atty to tell you that you are drop dead wrong on this one (a certified bartender can give you the scoop, because WE are responsible for our patrons.). It's not just what or how much you drink, but whether or not you have food/are eating/drinking water etc while doing so, your metobolism, and activity levels.

    For me, a small amount of alcohol will put me in DUI status in a hot hurry, for an alcoholic, although the effects are very minimal, they can drink an entire bottle and seem straight up. It doesn't matter what you REMEMBER drinking, but what your PBT and or blood test show to be in your system. Your BAC is NOT an exact science, everyone reacts differently.
  • 06-14-2010, 01:08 PM
    cdwjava
    Re: Chances of Winning a DUI Jury Trial
    Quote:

    Quoting vampiria
    View Post
    Sir, I asked a question and you gave your answer, thank you so much. But please don't try to convince me that I had more alcohol than I remember like the cops did on the field. To have .17 after 4 hours an average person should drink half a bottle. Same bottle is still there containing more than half and I wasn't the only one drinking whiskey that night. I have witnesses too, but I know they are not legal evidence. It's only my word against a high-tech breathalyzer. Chances of winning is slim to none.
    Now I'm a criminal, potential murderer, right.

    Well, I never said that. if you want to characterize yourself that way, go right ahead. Is there a potential for something horrible when you are impaired? Absolutely! Much more so than if not impaired. But, I never referred to you as a "potential murderer."

    And in spite of what you THINK, you may very well be wrong. People absorb alcohol at different rates. And, your assumption of "half a bottle" over four hours assume an even level of consumption, and that is not too likely. Possible, but not likely.

    Quote:

    But I can still speak my mind:

    Whoever reading this; if you ever asked for a breath test
    NEVER EVER BLOW ANY BREATHALYZER!!!!!!! Go for the blood test.
    Great. I like blood because it is rarely challenged and almost always results in a guilty plea or trial conviction.
  • 06-14-2010, 01:33 PM
    vampiria
    Re: Chances of Winning a DUI Jury Trial
    Guys. I didn't post here to argue if I'm guilty or not. I'm looking for an answer for only one question.
    Is there anybody ever dismissed at a DUI jury trial, if so how?

    This guy says he understands and he can help. Watch his videos about your very very accurate breathalyzers.
    http://www.avvo.com/attorneys/90036-...4/aboutme.html

    please, I don't want to hear any other comment about my memory and metabolism. Only post here if you have anything to say about jury trials.
  • 06-14-2010, 01:42 PM
    cdwjava
    Re: Chances of Winning a DUI Jury Trial
    Quote:

    Quoting vampiria
    View Post
    Guys. I didn't post here to argue if I'm guilty or not. I'm looking for an answer for only one question.
    Is there anybody ever dismissed at a DUI jury trial, if so how?

    Yes, it is POSSIBLE.

    The most common attacks are generally BEFORE trial, however. If the evidence (the chemical test and the officer's testimony of his or her observations) can be dismissed via suppression, the case goes away. Hence my previous mention of the challenge to the detention then the probable cause for the arrest. However, those occur before a trial. If those motions fail, the defense rarely prevails at trial.

    However, if the officer is inarticulate or inexperienced, the defense might be able to raise doubt with a jury as to the officer's ability to evaluate the impairment or work the breath device adequately, they might prevail. I have never lost a DUI case, and am an instructor for DUI evaluations, and do not have personal experience with a jury acquittal, but I know they have happened.

    The least likely successful defense is a technical battle of the experts unless some very obvious or well-publicized foul up has occurred involving the machine or agency maintaining and/or calibrating the machine or lab devices.

    Quote:

    This guy says he understands and he can help. Watch his videos about your very very accurate breathalyzers.
    Seen 'em. Understand he has a product to sell ... his services. He has a motivation to exaggerate certain findings. And, if he is good enough to exploit the device to raise doubt with a jury, great! It's rare, and I suspect that most his cases plead out anyway, but his job is to raise reasonable doubt and bill by the hour. Some of these guys can do the job well ... most make their suppression motions and then plead out.

    Quote:

    please, I don't want to hear any other comment about my memory and metabolism. Only post here if you have anything to say about jury trials.
    The nice thing about this site is you get the benefit of all levels of experience, including those that concern opinions on absorption rates, metabolism, and memory. I could wax on for pages on the effects and misperceptions involved with alcohol consumption if you'd like ... :D
  • 06-14-2010, 02:11 PM
    vampiria
    Re: Chances of Winning a DUI Jury Trial
    They didn't tell me the reason to stop, and they took me to jail at the front seat. Do you think it makes any difference?
  • 06-14-2010, 02:15 PM
    cdwjava
    Re: Chances of Winning a DUI Jury Trial
    Quote:

    Quoting vampiria
    View Post
    They didn't tell me the reason to stop, and they took me to jail at the front seat. Do you think it makes any difference?

    Not really. It will be the justification in the report that will indicate what they will testify to in court. What seat you are transported in is entirely irrelevant.

    They do not need a whole lot to justify the detention. Simply some observation giving rise to possible impairment, or a potential Vehicle Code violation are sufficient for the stop.
  • 06-14-2010, 02:28 PM
    vampiria
    Re: Chances of Winning a DUI Jury Trial
    Thank you for all the information. You were very helpful.
  • 06-15-2010, 08:55 AM
    chuckycheese
    Re: Chances of Winning a DUI Jury Trial
    Personally, if I blew a .17 twice, I'd go to court and ask for the 'standard disposition' and I wouldn't waste a nickel on a lawyer unless I thought there was some compelling reason that I could prevail. Just my opinion but I feel sure statistics would strongly support that choice.

    Ask your lawyer if he wants to do a 'double of nothing' deal on his fee... based on the outcome. It will be the quickest "NO" you've ever heard in your life!;)
  • 06-23-2010, 11:37 PM
    Admit Nothing
    Re: Chances of Winning a DUI Jury Trial
    You should probably request a public defender instead of hiring a private attorney, if you are eligible. Then the PD can see if there is anything fishy in the police report (which is all that will matter). If so, then spend your money on the expensive attorney if you don't trust the PD. Private attorneys are often (not always, since I myself don't do this) full of sunshine and butterflies only to later disappoint you with the not so sunny truth - hence him promising you that he will "fight to prove your innocence." That is what you are hiring him for, not a promise that he's going to be able to get you off.

    I cannot tell you how many times I heard my client's story and thought we might have a shot only to read the police report later and realize there was NOTHING that could be done. Luckily, I never take a DUI anymore without reading the police report, since there is almost never anything that can be done (as cdwjava explained in detail).

    Quote:

    Quoting cdwjava
    View Post
    I like blood because it is rarely challenged and almost always results in a guilty plea or trial conviction.

    Breath can't be re-tested. Blood can, and always comes out between .01 and .02 lower than the first test. Ergo, if you have a .09 at the station, come trial it will only be .07, which is awesome evidence against the (b) charge.

    Quote:

    Quoting chuckycheese
    View Post
    Ask your lawyer if he wants to do a 'double of nothing' deal on his fee... based on the outcome. It will be the quickest "NO" you've ever heard in your life!;)

    That is illegal in California. That's why he would get a no. Sometimes I'd gladly do it, dependent on the police report of course.
  • 06-24-2010, 12:55 AM
    cdwjava
    Re: Chances of Winning a DUI Jury Trial
    An option is given to the person giving a breath test (reference: CA v. Trombetta) that he or she has the option to have a blood test taken to be tested later at his or her own expense.
  • 06-30-2010, 09:47 AM
    LawHobbyistMN
    Re: Chances of Winning a DUI Jury Trial
    Don't trust those BAC estimators. They are called estimators for a reason. Whether or not the BAC is accurate you still committed a crime so you will be pleading guilty to a crime you did commit if that makes you feel better.
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