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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
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    5

    Default Can Owners Take Tips

    My question involves business law in the state of: california

    Can owners take service tips for employee's in their own restaurant?
    my owner takes 25% tip from our tip jar.

    The owner is a sushi man he works as well. he gives 10% to kitchen 25% to him self 65% to the service employee's

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    Il.(near StL,Mo.)
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    5,252

    Default Re: Can Owners Take Tips?

    Too often we underestimate the power of a touch, a smile, a kind word, a listening ear, an honest compliment, or the smallest act of caring, all of which have the potential to turn a life around.

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Location
    Michigan
    Posts
    28,644

    Default Re: Can Owners Take Tips?

    That document states:
    Quote Quoting Retention of Tips:
    The law forbids any arrangement between the employer and the tipped employee whereby any part of the tip received becomes the property of the employer. A tip is the sole property of the tipped employee. Where an employer does not strictly observe the tip credit provisions of the Act, no tip credit may be claimed and the employees are entitled to receive the full cash minimum wage, in addition to retaining tips they may/should have received.

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Posts
    5

    Default Re: Can Owners Take Tips?

    So, what can i do to my owner? tell a lawyer or contact some type of department?

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    Southeastern Michigan
    Posts
    1,226

    Default Re: Can Owners Take Tips?

    Try here for starters http://www.dir.ca.gov/

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    Il.(near StL,Mo.)
    Posts
    5,252

    Default Re: Can Owners Take Tips?

    You file a complaint with the Ca. DLSE.
    Too often we underestimate the power of a touch, a smile, a kind word, a listening ear, an honest compliment, or the smallest act of caring, all of which have the potential to turn a life around.

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Location
    Florida
    Posts
    1,875

    Default Re: Can Owners Take Tips?

    If the business is a corporation, and the owner is also an employee of the business providing services to the customer, as an employee I don't see why he would not be entitled to a share of the tips solely by virtue of also being a shareholder in the corporation.

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Posts
    27,273

    Default Re: Can Owners Take Tips?

    Quote Quoting Bubba Jimmy
    View Post
    If the business is a corporation, and the owner is also an employee of the business providing services to the customer, as an employee I don't see why he would not be entitled to a share of the tips solely by virtue of also being a shareholder in the corporation.

    For a person to be eligible for a tip pool, they must be regularly tipped employees. The owner/manager is not such a position so he would not be allowed to share in a tip pool if there were one.

    This person taking the tips is wrong in so many ways.

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Location
    Florida
    Posts
    1,875

    Default Re: Can Owners Take Tips?

    I wasn't commenting on the morality of the owner's practice, but on the legality. If the owner of the business is an employee of the business providing direct services to a customer who then puts money in the tip jar based on good service, there's no legal reason that everyone who provides direct service to the customers should not participate in the tips. Many owners wait tables, and they certainly may legally keep their tips.

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Posts
    27,273

    Default Re: Can Owners Take Tips?

    then read my post again.

    then read the DOL's take on the subject.



    A tipped employee means any employee engaged in an occupation in which he or she customarily and regularly receives more than $30 a month in tips.

    3) Allow the tipped employee to retain all tips, whether or not the employer elects to take a tip credit for tips received, except to the extent the employee participates in a valid tip pooling arrangement.
    just in case he would be entitled to any tips, (he's not) do you think he rates 25% of the tips?
    Dual Jobs: When an employee is employed concurrently in both a tipped and a non-tipped occupation, the tip credit is available only for the hours spent in the tipped occupation. The Act permits an employer to take the tip credit for time spent in duties related to the tipped occupation, even though such duties are not by themselves directed toward producing tips, provided such duties are incidental to the regular duties and are generally assigned to such occupations. Where tipped employees are routinely assigned to maintenance, or where tipped employees spend a substantial amount of time (in excess of 20 percent) performing general preparation work or maintenance, no tip credit may be taken for the time spent in such duties.
    Tip Pooling: The requirement that an employee must retain all tips does not preclude a valid tip pooling or sharing arrangement among employees who customarily and regularly receive tips, such as waiters, waitresses, bellhops, counter personnel (who serve customers), busboys/girls and service bartenders. Tipped employees may not be required to share their tips with employees who have not customarily and regularly participated in tip pooling arrangements, such as dishwashers, cooks, chefs, and janitors. Only those tips that are in excess of tips used for the tip credit may be taken for a pool. Tipped employees cannot be required to contribute a greater percentage of their tips than is customary and reasonable.
    So, to start with, the 10% going to the kitchen is illegal.

    Is the owner accounting for the employee recieving minimum wage first and then taking the remainder and pooling it?

    (so far we have 2 strikes against the guy)

    Now this one I can't answer but is a "sushi man" a counter person that serves customers or is he more of a kitchen or chef guy?

    I would think the latter so now, if true, we have strike 3.



    also notice that everything the DOL states is in relation to an EMPLOYEE. So, do you think that when this guy goes to the bank and applies for a loan under occupation he puts down "sushi chef" or "owner of JimBobs sushi and chitlins bar"?

    So, do you really think this guy still deserves to take the tips?

    If so, lets go to Californias statutes.

    california labor code 350-

    (a) "Employer" means every person engaged in any business or
    enterprise in this state that has one or more persons in service
    under any appointment, contract of hire, or apprenticeship, express
    or implied, oral or written, irrespective of whether the person is
    the owner of the business or is operating on a concessionaire or
    other basis



    and from the FAQ at http://www.dir.ca.gov/dlse/FAQ_TipsAndGratutities.htm

    Q.I work in a large restaurant as a waiter. My employer told me that I am required to share my tips with the busboy and the bartender. Am I obligated to do this?

    Yes. According to a California court, Labor Code Section 351 allows involuntary tip pooling. Therefore, your employer can require that you share your tips with other staff that provide service in the restaurant. In this regard, it’s DLSE’s position that when a tip pooling arrangement if in effect, the tips are to be distributed among the employees who provide "direct table service." Such employees could conceivably include waiters and waitresses, busboys, bartenders, host/hostesses and maitre d’s. Employees who do not provide direct table service and who do not share in the tip pool include dishwashers, cooks, and chefs, except in restaurants where the chefs prepare the food at the patron’s table, in which case the chef may participate in the tip pool. Additionally, tip pooling cannot be used to compensate the owner(s), manager(s), or supervisor(s) of the business, even if these individuals should provide direct table service to a patron.
    351. No employer or agent shall collect, take, or receive any
    gratuity or a part thereof that is paid, given to, or left for an
    employee by a patron, or deduct any amount from wages due an employee
    on account of a gratuity, or require an employee to credit the
    amount, or any part thereof, of a gratuity against and as a part of
    the wages due the employee from the employer. Every gratuity is
    hereby declared to be the sole property of the employee or employees
    to whom it was paid, given, or left for. An employer that permits
    patrons to pay gratuities by credit card shall pay the employees the
    full amount of the gratuity that the patron indicated on the credit
    card slip, without any deductions for any credit card payment
    processing fees or costs that may be charged to the employer by the
    credit card company. Payment of gratuities made by patrons using
    credit cards shall be made to the employees not later than the next
    regular payday following the date the patron authorized the credit
    card payment.

    So, what were you saying about speaking to the legality of the owner taking the tips?????????

    and to this statement:

    Many owners wait tables, and they certainly may legally keep their tips.
    as you see, you are wrong if it involves tip pooling.





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