Fired After Asking for Thirty Days Off, HR Claims I Quit

[Beagle_lover]

My question involves unemployment benefits for the state of: California

Friday night 45 minutes before my shift end. I let my boss know the specific dates of a trip out of the US with my wife which already verbally was confirmed was ok just get the boss specific date. The discussion morphed into me not taking my job seriously. He then stated "lock down your PC, get your things and give me your badge and follow me." He then escorted me out of the building and said he no longer trusts me in the office anymore. I drove home and called a co-worker who stated he heard from the bosses closest employee I am fired. I was also locked out of all my accounts from home.

Then Monday rolls around and I ask HR for my final check. They said I was not fired and to come back to work, he did not have the authority to terminate me. I stated I simply want to move on, I was under the impression I was fired and it seemed very real to me and I began the job hunt. She stated that if I do not return to work then I am quitting voluntarily. This whole thing is terrible and I just want to know if I can get my unemployment and begin looking for work. I have never collected unemployment and not sure how this works but I cannot accept that now suddenly I am not fired but I quit. Its quickly becoming a matter of principle now.

Also she said I can have my job back but when I go on my trip it is job abandonment and at time I am no longer employed. I don't feel that is appropriate. So I am fired either way? Why even bring me back?

Any critiques or advice?

[jk]

. She stated that if I do not return to work then I am quitting voluntarily.

and she was right.

This whole thing is terrible and I just want to know if I can get my unemployment and begin looking for work.

Probably not. Usually when you quit without good cause, you are ineligible for unemployment ibenefits. I would still file but don't be surprised if they say you are disqualified.

Also she said I can have my job back but when I go on my trip it is job abandonment and at time I am no longer employed. I don't feel that is appropriate. So I am fired either way? Why even bring me back?

and if they did not give you permission to take the time off, yes, it would be job abandonment which again, generally disqualifies you for unemployment benefits.

[chyvan]

I have a different take on it. Once your supervisor did what was done, you were probably discharged for something other than misconduct. However, once the other person told you to come back to work that would be a refusal of work. Refusals of work are easier than quits, but still no picnic.

Then there's your vacation issue and what's going to happen later down the road.

Sounds like the HR rep might be sympathic to your situation. Try to negotiate approval for your vacation, and go back to work.

[Foster_Foster]

"They said I was not fired and to come back to work, he did not have the authority to terminate me. I stated I simply want to move on, I was under the impression I was fired and it seemed very real to me and I began the job hunt."

Then you essentially quit.

You're a free person and free to look for work even when you have a job. You won't, however, get unemployment benefits under the circumstances described.

"Its quickly becoming a matter of principle now. "

And you have to be willing to pay for principle. I can't fathom your reasoning here.

"Also she said I can have my job back but when I go on my trip it is job abandonment and at time I am no longer employed."

The employer isn't obligated to approve any vacation, let alone a 30-day vacation. (If it was FMLA leave, they wouldn't be in a position to refuse, but it isn't.)

[cbg]

Here's what it sounds like to me.

Your 30 day vacation is NOT approved. You can come back to work without your 30 day vacation, or you can take your 30 day vacation and no longer have a job. You cannot take your 30 day vacation and still return to work.

If you opt to take the vacation, the employer is going to call it a quit since they are offering to return you to work. They have a pretty strong case for that. If push comes to shove, they might very well win. If I were a betting woman, my money would be on the employer.

You are free to take your vacation and then claim you were fired. You do not have a strong case but I've seen some strange UI decisions on both sides of the board. I would not expect you to prevail but it's your gamble to take or lose.

[Beagle_lover]

Thank you for the responses.

A few issues I have is that is, that it was known I was going away for 30 days with a verbal confirmation. "Just get the dates and I'll approve it" I wrote a wrong date which made it seem like six weeks he was already fired up and would not let me correct the mistake. Then canned the whole trip, "I want you to quit right now, resign and put in your two weeks, or just quit". We had meetings where I discussed I was leaving and what was the plan while I am gone this was not a sudden blow to the organization. He told me as I he was escorting me to the parking lot that he could not keep me he does not trust me and that I was fake and don't care about the job which is wrong. I can't just get rid a 3000 dollar trip to have a traditional Vietnamese wedding in my wife's home country. I even offered to put a two notice in before the two weeks ahead of the trip to keep the reference. He did not accept. I would think that is the end of it, time to find new work unfortunately.

Offering me my job 3 days later by someone in HR who I never met and don't know bothers me and the boss did not want to talk to me. They fight unemployment benefits for everything and the boss used to make jokes that he would not fire someone, he will make them want to quit. I have watched it happen more than once. I would NEVER quit on my own, my skin is to thick and up until the vacation I was a star employee and well liked. I think that is why he tried to fire me, he knew yelling and flipping out does not make me rattled like others. I really think its gross that the system is flawed in such a manner that this is considered acceptable. Its one thing to get fired and have that hanging over someones head and the confidence blow that brings. Its another to find some HR person arguing with you trying to say, "but you quit right" despite that my badge, my system was locked out, I emptied my desk and was escorted out. I accepted the termination and pain it brings, this is over kill. What is the time limitation?, you would think that if he had no intention of firing me I would at least be able to see emails or he would call me saying he over reacted. At work he telling his closest people he fired me. So he gets the stigma of firing me, without punishment of paying for some type of UI penalty?

I will file for benefits and see if I win or lose and try to update either way.

Thank you for your time and patience.

[Foster_Foster]

No need to recover old ground about what happened (though you've added a few more wrinkles).

You were already told by HR that he didn't have authority to fire, so I'm not sure why you'd go over an extraneous conversation with the "fired up" boss.

Even if your company has willy-nilly leave approval processes vs. very formal ones where most of it is verbal, bottom line is what it is. You've quit by choosing not to go back to work, so you can't expect unemployment benefits.

"I would NEVER quit on my own.."

But you kinda have if you refused to go back to work.

I suspect this decision will cost you far more than $3000 as it relates to trip expenses.

[jk]

I don't see anything that would change my mind either.

So, enjoy your vacation. Hopefully you have money to live without UI because I do not believe it will be granted. If it is granted, realize that you will more than likely not be eligible for UI during your 30 day trip to Viet Nam. That kind of makes you unable to accept immediate employment and it puts a serious hindrance to look for work (which is also a requirement to be eligible for UI).

[cbg]

Even if someone had carved permission for you to take those 30 days in stone, the employer may LEGALLY revoke that permission.