Non-Custodial Parent is Threatening Not to Return the Children

[whhoknu]

My question involves a child custody case from the State of: Illinois, but the kids and I live in WA and the NCP lives in MO

He's threatening not to give the kids back to me at then end of his visitation time because I won't pay for the kids to go to his wedding next year (and we do not have anything in written form saying I have to becasue it's NOT my responsibility). We are BOTH under a court order with dates, etc. that they are supposed to be there (in MO) and HE is responsible for transportation back to WA to get the kids to me. The police won't do anything if he doesn't give them back as there is no language in our agreement about parental kidnapping or anything of that nature anyway. What am I supposed to do?! Why should I take them there and chance not getting them back?! Yeah he can file contempt I understand that but I'll chance a contempt case if he is making these threats to not give them back. I'm not going to even get into the fact that he is compltely unstable and really would be dumb enough to pull something when they get down there....

[Mr. Knowitall]

If your ex- doesn't comply with the custody order, you can go back to court and seek enforcement.

If you choose not to comply with the order, I would not expect the court to have much sympathy for your argument that you violated its order because of a possibility that he might have violated the order had you complied. That's not how court orders work.

[whhoknu]

Will they do something as an emergency enforcement or will it be like everythig else where they simply don't care and schedule a hearing 6 weeks after the fact?

[Dogmatique]

This would not be an emergency.

And really - "they simply don't care"? Do you have any idea what goes on with your average family court's docket ? How many cases they have to deal with (often with parents who refuse to behave like adults and keep going back and forth to court over the silliest of matters)?

Let me put this another way. 6 weeks? In some jurisdictions, you'd be lucky to get a hearing in TWELVE weeks.

[whhoknu]

Then I should just chance him not giving them back to avoid being held in contempt and then if he decides not to bring them back to me like he's also court ordered to do it's not an emergency even though I have physical custody and I have to just suck it up until the courts get around to it right? That's essentially what is being said to me.

[Dogmatique]

Let's back up.

What proof do you have that he's threatening not to return the kids?

[whhoknu]

Physical proof none.... He called me no less than 8 times yesterday to argue with me and he said if I don't sign something to say I'm going to pay to get them to his wedding next year he won't give them back. It's NOT my responsibility! And I'm not going to be forced into an agreement because he wants to be a self serving prick. The exact words were "you'll get them back when I get something in writing saying you're bringing them down for my wedding" um no..... There is a court order saying they ate to be back to me no later than August 18th and HE is responsible for transportation. You guys just don't understand he is unstable. He's supposed to be on medication for bipolar and doesn't think he needs it..... I can't chance this I just can't..... We have been in court already last month that's when this order was written and the judge we saw was about as useless as they come. He had very little interest in actually solving the problems we have and instead makes temporary fixes (like this) to an even larger problem. I am terrified of what will happen if I follow the order then I don't get them back. Please give me some kind of guidance.

[Mr. Knowitall]

Then I should just chance him not giving them back to avoid being held in contempt and then if he decides not to bring them back to me like he's also court ordered to do it's not an emergency even though I have physical custody and I have to just suck it up until the courts get around to it right? That's essentially what is being said to me.

You really need to calm yourself down. It does you no good to get worked up over being told what the law requires of you.

To put it simply, the order applies to both of you. He has no right to violate the order in anticipation that you might do the same, and you have no right to violate the order to preempt a possible violation of the order. If you believe you have grounds to modify the order, go to court and seek modification. But unless and until you do that - and get a new order with different terms - you are expected to abide by the order as written, and so is he.

Sure, it's possible that you will have to take him to court if he violates the order in the future. Just as he will have to take you to court if you violate the order in the present. You have no more right to ignore the order than he does, and being the first parent to violate it simply makes you look unreasonable.

[Dogmatique]

Nobody is saying that paying to get the kids to his wedding next year is your responsibility.

However, your problem is you're lacking proof of both instability and proof that he's even issued such a threat. So, you don't - legally speaking - have a reason not to send the kids.

If either of you breaks the court order, you can both be found in contempt.

One more quick question - does the wedding take place during Dad's parenting time?

[whhoknu]

I know.....but I'm not sure how to modify it to make it to where id he does violate it I can get them back with no issues. I already have a car reserved and I'm saving money for gas so I've been getting ready to follow through but then he threatens that. I don't think he plans on following through with getting them back to me.

No his wedding is an extra time he's asking for. I don't have an issue letting them go. I'm just not going to be financially responsible for it.