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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Jan 2012
    Posts
    16

    Default Can the Police Handcuff You and Drag You into the Hospital Locked You Up

    My question involves police conduct in the State of:HI

    Against your will, for about 6 hours till midnight. It was not just hospital as the Police and PMS told me. It was psychiatric emergency. I was wondering why they took all you clothes items away and you were not allowed to talk to other patients. All the male personnel incl. dr. were very rude to you. The cop has been talking to them for a long time. They also yelled at you when you asked what you are signing, and didn't want to give you a copy of what you signed even you asked for if 5,6 time and that by law they should do that without asking.

    I was just going to get some fruits after lunch (gathering) in the membership club where they provided wheelchair and they always ready to help loading. I felt the weakness on my knees and buckled down after I returned the wheelchair. I wanted to made sure the club won't lost this expensive item. The buckling down happened many times and it's always unpredictable when it'd happened. Strangers and employees are always give me water and wheel me to my vehicle. I've never cause any trouble to anyone or any entity, well, except the time (like a few minutes?) and effort rendered for me.

    Been weak and "sick" all my life and the aging def. making it worse. Gave up finding what's wrong after years of checkup with everything "normal". Whenever my body is in "extreme" stress, there's always shortness of breath, crying and screaming and uncontrollable shaking. It is scary for people who don't know me. But after the shaking and screaming subside, I feel so much better. This must have been some mechanism to elevate the stress to compensate the regular ways as my lung and heart function is extremely weak. There are a lot of things I can't put in my mouth. And I can't get dehydrate. Every time I went to hospital, it was miserable, got more sick this way or other and took me quite some time to recover, i.e. contracting flu (3 months), drug me wrong (1 month)...

    Any way, the whole nightmare started when one couple in the food court insisted the club to call EMS. The EMS evokes horror to me. Just a few years ago, 2 pms almost killed me. Very long story, in short, they sat on me and choking me till I almost passed out, on purpose. They laughed with pleasure tying me up with my hands back like a mummy. Contacted police and complained to CEO, and lawyer. In the end, useless. no witness no evidence. Not only that, they got to put down in my medical record that I am "violent" to justify what they did to me, (I also got blood in my hands and clothes). Years of nightmares and psycho therapies, still haven't forgot. I vow never crawl on to the ambulance again.

    Despite my strong protest that I needed to go home, the club called EMS and didn't want me to leave nor gave me any water until I told them I would get in trouble as I was dehydrated, Just after the employee agreed to get me to the bathroom for water. The paramedics came. Had I known what was going to happened, I'd do anything in my power to get away from the scene. All I had was my car key. I wish I had my cell with me.

    I don't know why they need to send 4 cops and 3 PMS. And they are all hostile, lining up there blocking my way to the parking lot. By that time, I am shaking and screaming for water. Nobody did anything eventually the club employee got me so sparkling water, which made my heart beat even more violently. I requested pure water with nothing in it. The cops and PMS didn't budge. One PMS yelled after I showed them the sparkling water, again, it was the employee who went to get me the water which I pour down in a second. As the PMS order the employee not to give it to me any more. I struggled to crawl to get the water myself. They pushed me down the ground. The same PMS yell at me like thunder storm waving her hand "don't you ever touch me" when I held on her calf a litter to raise my head to breath out. Astonished, I looked at her name tag and tell them to go away as I don't need them and I hasten to get my water. It was basically life and death situation for me. Looking back I realize I was very lucky because there were tons of people there eating around us so they didn't restrain me from getting my water.

    They didn't allow me to have the wheelchair the club offered to my car. So I struggled to get up to my car, as they said if I can't stand up, they had to take me. Mistake. A cop said, how could you do that to a cop? What did I do to him? trying to save my own life and refuse to go to hospital? female cop said "o---h---, she actually can walk"; 2 cops caught up to "support" me but when I needed to lean on him he got away saying why didn't I walk on my own, then 4 of them pushed me on the ground when I located my car where there's nobody else anymore except 1 employee peeing from some distance with concern. I gave them the info. they asked, let them poke me for blood, tell them about my body why I don't want to go to hospital in the ambulance, so they'd leave me alone. What a dumb mistake. you don't want to go to hospital? they'd make sure you go. Don't want to go with ambulance? they said they have to handcuff me if I go with the cop. Never been handcuffed before, it hurts, my wrist are red and swollen. I asked the cop is it even legal the cop said he talked to police psychiatrist, I am in danger of myself and everyone. hmm, I am 100lb weak and sick being pushed on the ground all of them towering over me. I am educated (post graduate) never been physical with anybody never break any law. When I see a sick bird on the ground, I'd either take them to human society or try to nurse it myself. I asked to speak to their psychiatrist, the cop said no I couldn't talk to their psychiatrist. The cop also said that I am so dangerous, it's not even safe for the 3 paramedic to deal with me. They shoveled me into the back the police car, drag me out into the emergency room telling people that I could walk I was just faking it no need to give me any chair or wheelchair. It's been a while before the pimpled female cop took off the handcuff telling me to behave they'd just doing the job. I found I have bruise scratches here and there. My arm has bruise from the cop's thumb and hands when she dragged me. The mental side is way more profound. I worry can't eat nor sleep much.

    I am deeply concerned how from this point I'd go around in public, esp. taking care of survival needs like grocery. Very stressful and difficult time. Already has so many unfortunate events besides of this one. The thought of somebody powerful enough to cut you off air, water (I may not be lucky next time) and take away your freedom just like that, or may even force drug into your body is very scary. It can easily be lethal situation for my body.

    Appreciate if anybody knows better about the situation:

    -- can they handcuff me? I def. think they used unreasonable restrain

    -- when can they force me to hospital against my will? Obviously, they didn't get me to hospital to help me. In the hospital, all they did was to get me blood pressure and get urine sample. I refused to be poked to give them more blood.

    -- can I file a complaint without names and badge #? there were so many witness around I wonder how come nobody interfere

    -- why the fact that I couldn't stand up got me to psychiatric unit? Every time before they leave me they ask me ridiculous questions like would you hurt yourself? would you hurt somebody else? Sounds so absurd. I am really afraid that they'd establish that I am a psycho and they can do anything to me.

    -- Is it a mistake that I told them I am alone have nobody to depend on? Of course, I could call around and the thought of bothering people becomes minor had I known what were to happened.

    -- Is there anything I could do not to have to get PMS and cops get involved when I buckle down, which I can't prevent?

    -- What can I do act to make the best of it if PMS and cops are called in again next time?

    -- Would it work if I get some doctors note to say no need to call EMS, cops, or that I am not psycho in danger of any one, or I am totally alright to drive a vehicle, or would doctor write something like that?

    Thanks a lot. Sorry it's kinda long.

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Location
    OH10
    Posts
    14,028

    Default Re: Can the Police Handcuff You and Drag You into the Hospital Locked You Up

    Regardless of your disability, it is reasonable for an officer to take you into custody and make you submit to psychiatric evaluation if he feels you are exhibiting dangerous behaviors. Your recourse, appears to be for you to only go into public locations with an advocate, familiar with your aberrant behaviors.
    With enough thrust, pigs fly just fine.
    You may believe that you understood what you think I said. I'm not sure you realize that what you heard is not what I meant.

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Location
    Behind a Desk
    Posts
    73,755

    Default Re: Can the Police Handcuff You and Drag You into the Hospital Locked You Up

    If I can condense that, it would appear that you are physically and mentally ill, you entered into a state of "shortness of breath, crying and screaming and uncontrollable shaking" which you admit looks frightening to strangers and, given the choice between having you go to a hospital for treatment or carting you off to jail for creating a public disturbance and being uncooperative with their efforts to help you, the police decided that you should go to a hospital.

    Parts of your narrative are difficult to follow.... "2 cops caught up to 'support' me but when I needed to lean on him he got away saying why didn't I walk on my own, then 4 of them pushed me on the ground when I located my car where there's nobody else anymore except 1 employee peeing from some distance with concern." Why use scare quotes around "support"? What do you mean "he got away"? Where did the other two officers come from? If you weren't able to stand and walk, why was it necessary for them to "push" you to the ground? And surely you don't actually mean "peeing".... Why did the officers view you as being combative and in need of restraint? Were you in fact fighting them, physically?

    If you're arguing that you were in control of your mental state this entire time, it would seem that you should be charged with some sort of disorderly persons offense. If you were hysterical, screaming, fighting, shaking, unable to catch your breath, uncooperative, acting in a manner you know is "scary for people who don't know" you, but could not stop or control any of that.... it's not at all surprising that you ended up at the E.R. What else would you expect the police to do under the circumstances?

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Jan 2012
    Posts
    16

    Default Re: Can the Police Handcuff You and Drag You into the Hospital Locked You Up

    Thank you for responding, Mr. Knowitall. I can hardly say what you said is subjective though. Are you a cop yourself or something? Let's just say, would you like to read what you write to yourself or your children, your parents or your siblings if this happened to yourself and your loved ones? I have to say it's pretty heartless to call it "creating a public disturbance and being uncooperative" when someone is in distress; fear for and try to save his own life, while all the "professionals" were standing there staring at you, yelled at you, pushed you down, denied you wheel chair and water. Who caused the disturbance, 1st of all? Had them not been involved, I'd have had already gone home quietlylike so many times before, I'd clearly told them to let me go, and kept urging them for water specifically told them I'd get in trouble before the shaking start. 2nd, even I crawl all the way on ground to get enough water down my body to stop the shaking, they gave me a hard time,making it a bigger scene.

    What "efforts to help" you are talking about? In addition to above things they did to "help", brushing me away, waiving pointing a finger at me, yelled at me like thunder storm, roughing me around, poking (my finger, ok, that's help, useless and at my expense, didn't I tell them I just ate? appetizer, entry and desert and sampling? problem is the food is way saltier > my own) taunting, cuffing and dragging...

    What treatment? more yelling, striping all your clothes, 6 hr lockup in cold isolation room? and, urine sample? Not letting to poke me for more blood. Yeah, right, like they care for you and wanted to help you? they just want find drug in your system, to help to justify whatever deeds they did to you. Give you water, you'd dilute it. It's just unbelievably sick. I remember last time when the 2 PMS almost killed me, they didn't give me any water, sucked up all my limited blood. I really thought they were helping me to find out my problem, I am so darn naive, so trusting people (my god, when would I ever change and put on guard for my own protection), any way, guess what, there're gazillion 20-40? drugs or something they checked on. The only one I recognized was marijuana. After they found nothing, oh, scanned the heck out of your body and brain (get cancer at your own risk, CT scan 500 times radiation >X ray), CT, MRI, and MRI w dye, OMG, poked me 7 time 4 different places before a supervisor called in to make it into my little vein the dye was cause so much pain), said I had something in my brain. 1 second I had seizure, next second I don't, all mentioned in 1 conversation, didn't prevent them to put some seizure drug to my vein. It was so scary when I can't tell the sky from ground not knowing whether I touched the group. My brian is the best part of my body. I am a smart ass. Guess what drug they put in my record, nothing, like it never happened. Mr. Knowitall, is it considered FRAUD? The "something" in my brain after 7 years follow up, it was decided it was nothing abnormal. thousands spent months of recovery from hospital stay, mental and physical torture, all for nothing.

    Mr. Knowitall, you don't know me, you are not a physician, nor psychiatrist to judge that I am physically and mentally sick. Well, after what they did, I def. am stepping up to mentally sick scale. Many physical conditions can cause "shortness of breath, crying and screaming and uncontrollable shaking", i.e, heart attack, seizure and many other disorders. In my case, the falling down is nothing more than you feel dizzy when you get up all of sudden some times, or you feel pain in chest when you are running based on a few years of experience. And just what kind of mentally illness of shaking scream can be stop right away by drinking water. people around me would give me lots of massage, hot water, heat pack . simple as that, so we learn. If I have mental illness, you don't think they'd send me away? Nobody, including strangers, except you, even those good old days PMS ever thought I was mentally sick. Everyone's (strangers in and out stores) always help me around doing different little things seeing me in wheelchair. Well, that makes me trust everybody without any reservation until proved wrong.

    All 4 cops 3 paramedics all followed me around when I stood up to my car, 2 grabbed my arms. Looks like and made me, and the crowd think they help me when I didn't need it. Soon as I felt the weakness ready to kneel down again, one cop let go of his grip and walked away so my whole body tilted. They sure "support" the bruises out of my arm. Sorry, peeking, not peeing, typo, my bad.

    I "should be charged with some sort of disorderly persons offense"? Based on what law? And base on what they can handcuff me and force me to PSYCHOTIC ER? Could it be that they found out that they have to establish that I was psycho to justify to lock me up in the hospital, because, by law, they can't just take anyone to hospital without consent under other circumstances, right? Mr. Knowitall. I'd take it if you come up with something legit. Remember, they change their earlier story that they had to take me if I can't stand up. Sure, they know you don't have experience dealing with them, they'd get you.

    May be you know how to contact the officers to find out why they "view you (me) as being combative" The store should have surveillance cameras, may be you know how to get the tape that covered the whole event. I've love to have it and we can play it. Cameras don't lie like human. I already stated that I was sitting down giving them everything they asked for me, explain to them about my body. Then they cuffed me. I wonder what questions you come up to defense the action for those who got beaten up by cops for nothing, incl. pregnant woman or a dad whose son just died and who just called 911.

    I could have died or passed out right there if I don't have the water. Well if that happened, so what? These people have the license to kill. Like you said here, "public disturbance, uncooperative, fighting physically....." Whatever, make up some crap in your records. Case closed. This is a powerful machine. I am sure for now you know it very well. That's the scary part, that's the problem.

    Not going to further dignify all these questions, nor repeat the event again. Not healthy. I hope there's something to learn here. I hope nobody has to go through what I had. I need to search and sort out for solutions as how I manage to go out from these point on. And if it helps/benefit to other member(s) will post. For now, what I got is, 1)take care of yourself def. 2) put your guard on. 3)Take down all names, badge numbers of pms and officers no matter what 4)ask for supervisor to come if something is not right 5)call up civil right attorney if you have one 6) remember, cameras don't lie 7) belong to groups and community(ies) help each other out...

    If you have something to share, please let me know, or, have a good one. Thank you

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Location
    OH10
    Posts
    14,028

    Default Re: Can the Police Handcuff You and Drag You into the Hospital Locked You Up

    We did share. You did not like our answers because they did not agree with your opinion. Good Luck in your future.
    With enough thrust, pigs fly just fine.
    You may believe that you understood what you think I said. I'm not sure you realize that what you heard is not what I meant.

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