Does an Officer Have to Disclose the Statute Charged at the Time of Citation

[OrangeFL]

My question involves traffic court in the State of: Florida, County of Orange

I was given a ticket for the written cause:
"None/Improper Muffler
Muffler Removed"

by a city officer outside city limits though the location he cited me for is within the city limits. I am investigating whether or not they have a reciprocal agreement that allows them to write in the other's territory.

During the stop I went against my general do not answer questions policy thinking there's no way I had done anything wrong. I admitted to having an aftermarket exhaust but my car does have proper emissions equipment and I can datalog to prove that it is functional and it does have a muffler which I stated during the stop.

During the stop I asked the officer to please write on the ticket what staute I am being charged with and he said no. I then asked him to tell me what statute I am being charged with and he declined again. He told me I could go in the online myclerk system that orange county has to look up the ticket. The problem is it takes 7-14 days in my experience for citation to show up in this system and it is very frequently down. For example it has been down all day today and is currently down right now.

I looked up the law governing citations and the rules of traffic court regarding discovery but came up empty handed.
Law:
http://law.onecle.com/florida/motor-...s/316.650.html
Rules of Traffic Court:
http://www.floridabar.org/TFB/TFBRes...df?OpenElement

Any help you could provide is greatly appreciated. I am a resident of the city I was cited in. I live in a wealthy area that has a lot of modified cars. I think they would have to write up half my street if they were going to start enforcing this as even my next door neighbor the former mayor of the city has modified exhaust on his truck.

[aardvarc]

Just like all the cities in Seminole County have mutual aid agreements, so do the cities in Orange County. Almost all jurisdictions within the state have such agreements in place, so jurisdiction really hasn't been an issue in over a decade in the Central Florida area.

The usual muffler citation is given for violation of F.S. 316.272, which is a noncriminal traffic infraction, punishable as provided in Chapter 318, Florida Statutes. However, there may also be county or city ordinances which may apply on TOP of the state statute violation. The exact sections of the appropriate law should appear on the ticket when it comes up online, or, you can try calling the Orange County Clerk of Court with the number on your Uniform Traffic Citation and ask them.


You can use forms here to file your not guilty plea and request a hearing:

http://www.myorangeclerk.com/enu/Doc...Value1=Traffic

What are you seeking in discovery?

BTW, the Clerk's site appears to be up and running now.

[OrangeFL]

Thank you for your reply. What I am seeking is what statute specifically he intended to charge me with (as suggested I can look online) but also whether it was legal for him to write me a citation but actively deny telling me or providing me in writing the information I need to make a proper defense. I.E. What actual statute is it? In addition to 316.272 there is http://www.leg.state.fl.us/statutes/.../0316.293.html

To reword the thread title, does not telling me the statute I am being charged with when asked and not providing it to me in writing violate my right of discovery and/or my sixth amendment rights?

[aardvarc]

Not until you choose to take the matter to court, by contesting the ticket and requesting a hearing. Until there's such a case, there's no discovery issue.

[quirkyquark]

To reword the thread title, does not telling me the statute I am being charged with when asked and not providing it to me in writing violate my right of discovery and/or my sixth amendment rights?

Any consequences to discovery are immaterial here as Catherine stated. As for sixth amendment rights, I'm going from California law, but I presume other states are similar: you need to be given notice in words sufficient for a reasonable person to know what they're charged with -- the statute number is not required. In fact, in CA just putting a statute number down with no description makes notices/complaints/informations/etc. invalid!

[OrangeFL]

Yes but the words given are not sufficient for me to know what I have been charged with. It could easily be two different Florida traffic statutes.

[quirkyquark]

Traffic infractions in Florida are NOT CRIMINAL so very few protections apply. You'll have to check with the court to find out exactly which statute you were cited for.

[blewis]

You also need to keep in mind that even if a "charging document" is deemed to be insufficient for failure to provide a description of the offense, it will usually be dismissed WITHOUT prejudice. That means that the prosecutor (or the officer) can simply write out ANOTHER ticket -- being more specific this time.

Barry

[OrangeFL]

Thanks for the info guys. As far as representing myself in court I have 9 dismissals and 1 withhold in which I pleaded no contest but was not ordered to go to traffic school so I should still have that as a backup. Myclerk has not updated with what the charge is so I am still in the dark 4 days later. After speaking with a local officer he said the typical citation is 316.272. I would be fine with this as it should be easy to demonstrate that I do not meet the criteria to be cited for that statute.

It is possible that I may be charged with 316.293(5). This would be very bad as this statute could be the poster-child for lending itself to arbitrary and capricious enforcement. Easily 5-10% of all cars on the road violate that statute. I did some goolging but it does not appear that this statute has gone in front of an appellate court in Florida. Another noise ordinance has which referenced that one and dealt with due process due to vagueness but it was an ACLU suit primarily in the defense of free speech.

If I am charged with this would it be possible to get it dismissed as a result of due process, even in traffic court? When is it appropriate to submit a motion for dismissal based on the due process argument should it be merited? (E.G. In court, before I plea; when I submit my paper work to elect a trial, etc.)

Thanks again for your help. I really enjoy learning about law.

[quirkyquark]

If I am charged with this would it be possible to get it dismissed as a result of due process, even in traffic court? When is it appropriate to submit a motion for dismissal based on the due process argument should it be merited? (E.G. In court, before I plea; when I submit my paper work to elect a trial, etc.)

Maybe...due process is often invoked in criminal cases, but I believe there is a narrower kind of due process for civil cases, which means quite literally following the correct procedure. You need to find some sort of statute, court rule, etc. that is directly applicable to you and then use that to motion for a dismissal. By way of contrast, in a criminal case you could possible make up your own argument about how something violates due process as an abstract concept.