Egress Ingress Easement

[djharry]

My question involves real estate located in the State of: Florida

Im writing on behalf of 65 residents on Margate , FL we have an interesting issue, along side our backyards there is the C-14 Canal , Broward County its building their Greenway project (bike path 12 feet wide), we had always had a dirt road allow us vehicular access to our backyards ,many of my neighboors have RV's, boats etc etc and had made a lifestyle out of it, all of sudden comes a letter from our local municipality stating that they will no longer allow access to our backyards and a gate will be installed by SFWMD , our city is behind us , set up meetings with all parties involved , last meeting our City suggested that SFWMD give up some land so we can use for access to our backyards , the District replied that was not posible first because there wasn't enough space (not true there is somewhere in between 30 to 25 feet from the sidewalk to our property line) and Oh surprise , they dont own the land, there are only there by easement agreement sign by Hammon Inc in 1959 (Hammon Inc no longer exists and the owner died 30 years ago ), the portion of the canal and its banks its oficially listed in Broward County Property Appraiser as Public Land % SFWMD completely different than the entire lenght of the rest of the canal that is listed as right of way or if you check other canals like C-13 its properly listed as SFWMD ,I have found out that it was listed as such since 2008 (extrangely around when the project was in plans) I couldnt get access as how it was listed before 2008 but anyways by being named public Land we have been sugested to all together file for ingress egress eastment since SFWMD wants to not work with us we are getting together as how we can work this out , any suggestions ???? please help

[Newtons_Apple]

My question involves real estate located in the State of: Florida

Im writing on behalf of 65 residents on Margate , FL we have an interesting issue, along side our backyards there is the C-14 Canal , Broward County its building their Greenway project (bike path 12 feet wide), we had always had a dirt road allow us vehicular access to our backyards ,many of my neighboors have RV's, boats etc etc and had made a lifestyle out of it, all of sudden comes a letter from our local municipality stating that they will no longer allow access to our backyards and a gate will be installed by SFWMD , our city is behind us , set up meetings with all parties involved , last meeting our City suggested that SFWMD give up some land so we can use for access to our backyards , the District replied that was not posible first because there wasn't enough space (not true there is somewhere in between 30 to 25 feet from the sidewalk to our property line) and Oh surprise , they dont own the land, there are only there by easement agreement sign by Hammon Inc in 1959 (Hammon Inc no longer exists and the owner died 30 years ago ), the portion of the canal and its banks its oficially listed in Broward County Property Appraiser as Public Land % SFWMD completely different than the entire lenght of the rest of the canal that is listed as right of way or if you check other canals like C-13 its properly listed as SFWMD ,I have found out that it was listed as such since 2008 (extrangely around when the project was in plans) I couldnt get access as how it was listed before 2008 but anyways by being named public Land we have been sugested to all together file for ingress egress eastment since SFWMD wants to not work with us we are getting together as how we can work this out , any suggestions ???? please help

With all due respect to you and the problem at hand, it is very difficult for me to understand the situation because frankly, your post is poorly written. I can see how a comment like that would make you angry, but how am I supposed to offer advice if I cannot understand you?

Anyway, I have some questions:

1) You say you always had a dirt road which you used for access. How long (in years) has the dirt road been used?

2) A letter arrived from the City that read "they will no longer allow access to our backyards." Does this mean that you all had permissive use (possibly in writing) to cross over City property?

3) What does the Water District have to do with the Greenway Project?

Some comments:

A) The fact that Hammon Inc "no longer exists" is immaterial in regards to the existence of an easement benefiting SFWMD. Once an easement is granted, it cannot be revoked unless the dominant tenement (SFWMD) allows it to be revoked. Also an easement typically runs with the land, and not the individual. While SFWMD may not own the land, this is also immaterial since they have an easement granting them use of the land.

As an aside, most Water Districts are very defensive of the areas they control, especially around water supplies and main lines. This is for good reason, as they are responsible for providing clean and safe water to everyone.

B) You could try suing for a prescriptive easement for your dirt road. It may be very difficult to accomplish this seeing as prescriptive rights are very rarely granted against a Sovereign government (the City), especially when the land is in the interest of the Public good (ie clean water).

I recommend speaking with a boundary or real estate lawyer in your area to see what, if anything, you can do.

Hope this helps.

[djharry]

Its difficult to summarized all the facts in a short paragraph and I didnt want to make the reading boring but anyways to answer your questions ;1 Our houses wer built in the late 70's we have residents living here for over 25 years or more and the main reasons they bought was for the backyard access,so it has been like that since contruction of our houses , 2 The city doenst own the property there were inform by the county that the vehicular access would be block so the city proceed to notify us, some of the older residents believe that we had something in writing but we avent been able to find it or it may not exist, in over 25 years years nobody has ever been cited for using that access road 3. The Greenway project is a county project and the county requested permits from SFWMD to build it alongside the C-14 Canal , in the entire lenght of the canal the property shows just like right of way but in the portion of the canal adjacent to ou properties it shows Public Land % SFWMD .

[LandSurveyor]

The County Property Appraiser is possibly the last person who will have up to date information on actual ownership rights of government owned property. As it is non-taxable, they waste no resources on making sure the information is correct. It's off their radar. The information you need will be elsewhere in the county offices.

Some bike path proponents tend to look at things like publicly owned land, "abandoned" railways, etc. as cost free rights of way for their higher "purpose".

Several things need to be worked out for answers:

Is the canal owned in fee simple by the district, or is a right of way or easement? If a right of way, is it public or private? What are the written terms of the right of way or easement?

Does the original plat or plats creating the 65 owner parcels show an easement or right of way adjacent to your lots?

Who will operate and be liable for the bike path, the district, Margate, or both?

Has the dirt road been open to public use by access from a public road or street, even if the public rarely uses it?

As the previous poster has suggested, you are going to need local legal advice to sort this out. With 65 of you to share the costs, you will likely be able to determine your chances of success at a reasonable cost. You will need a professional to research this. The questions we have posed are just a start.

Good Luck!

[djharry]

The district its only there by easement deed , as stated by their Right of way director on our public hearing they dont own it, the easement deed grants them access for flood control, drainage etc , the property its oficially listed in county apprairser as Public Land % SFWMD , extrangely when you click left or right on the canal it only shows right of way but this specific portion of the canal shows that name on it , the original plat and its associated deed owned by oriole homes shows the eastment and it states drom this point to this point minus 260 feet easement ,who will be liable thats a good question since it will be on district land , built by the county and transfer over after completion to the city for maintenance (the city does not want that since they signed the agreement back in 2006 when they had the money to do it ) the dirt road yes it has been open from a public road even though there is a sign there that says no unauthorized vehicles allowed , as owner driving a registred vehicle for acccess to my property we never saw why we were unauthorized, nobody has ever been cited for tresspasing or anything similar, our local police department knows we use that road and has no problem , the road is used by the residents to drive their boats RV's in and out , some people use it daily to park their pick ups or vans instead of in the front where there is not enogh space

[LandSurveyor]

the property its oficially listed in county apprairser as Public Land % SFWMD , extrangely when you click left or right on the canal it only shows right of way but this specific portion of the canal shows that name on it

Perhaps I was too subtle in my first post. The information on public land found at the county appraiser is of no importance to you whatever.

A I read the above posts, I see that you have been advised twice to get local expert help on this. What you are trying to solve is not a do-it-yourself project.

[djharry]

We will ty we are just trying to get some new ideas or inputs that can help us