Speeding and Crossing Double Lines

[powers8989]

My question involves a careless driving ticket from the State of: CA

I got pulled over coming downhill through notoriously twisty roads... the officer was parked in a blind corner(speed trap). I came around the corner rapidly but had braked in the wrong place and was forced to cross the double yellow to correct. he pulled me over and wrote me for speeding and crossing the double yellow. the officer did not have radar and on the ticket says 50+ in 30... i do not believe i was going 50 it may have appeared that i was going faster due to my braking ineptitude... an accident due to unfamiliarity with the road was the cause of me swerving over the double yellow. any chance i can fight this? (cant go to traffic school)

any insight would be appreciated

[flyingron]

If you weren't using excessive speed you wouldn't have need the Sterling Moss-caliber braking procedures to keep from careening out of your lane.
The cop is trained to estimate speed, so absent something convincing on your part other than you were out of control, you won't refute his estimation.

[That Guy]

I got pulled over coming downhill through notoriously twisty roads... the officer was parked in a blind corner(speed trap).

Parking (or even "hiding") in a blind corner does not meet the legal definition of a "speed trap".

I came around the corner rapidly but had braked in the wrong place and was forced to cross the double yellow to correct. he pulled me over and wrote me for speeding and crossing the double yellow. the officer did not have radar and on the ticket says 50+ in 30... i do not believe i was going 50 it may have appeared that i was going faster due to my braking ineptitude... an accident due to unfamiliarity with the road was the cause of me swerving over the double yellow. any chance i can fight this? (cant go to traffic school)

any insight would be appreciated

Which code sections were you cited for?

[powers8989]

Parking (or even "hiding") in a blind corner does not meet the legal definition of a "speed trap".


Which code sections were you cited for?

22350
21460(A)

thank you!

[That Guy]

22350
21460(A)

thank you!

Based on what you posted, the 21460(a) will be difficult to beat... As for the 22350, your only saving grace would be if the 30mph speed limit is not justified by a valid Engineering and Traffic Survey (read CVC 40802 which I linked above).

You should contact CalTrans and request a copy of the most recent survey that was conducted for that stretch of road... When you get it, post it here and we'll go from there.

[HonkingAntelope]

Based on what you posted, the 21460(a) will be difficult to beat... As for the 22350, your only saving grace would be if the 30mph speed limit is not justified by a valid Engineering and Traffic Survey (read CVC 40802 which I linked above).

You should contact CalTrans and request a copy of the most recent survey that was conducted for that stretch of road... When you get it, post it here and we'll go from there.

Crossing over into the oncoming lane due to botched braking is pretty damning evidence of unsafe speed. Besides, speed survey wouldn't even come into play since the speed was determined by a visual estimate rather than radar.

OP, do you have any recollection of your conversation with the officer? In partciular, how far out did you cross into the oncoming lane? Also did you give the cop any bad attitude? It's not really common for CA officers to cite two moving violations on a single ticket (even when the driver does just that) unless the driving was REALLY bad or the driver's attitude really sucked. I hate to tell you this, but that ticket won't be cheap, and two new moving violations will mean a pretty major insurance hike, too.

There are a few ways you could go from here, but it would be nice to have the answers to the questions above first.

[powers8989]

I was respectful and immediately apologized, said I didnt realize my speed but didn't admit guilt... I was very calm and collected and immediately pulled over. the officer didnt even say i had crossed the double yellow until i read it on the ticket (to tell u the truth I dont recall crossing the double yellow, heat of the moment i could have. I was surprised when i read that on the ticket.) my tires did make a slight screaching due to over inflation 40psi instead of 35 and i slowed down as soon as i saw the officer. he said I "careened around the corner" or something to that nature. I graciously said goodbye and that it would'nt happen again... asked for a warning and the officer said to talk to the court. I can tell you i was not going twenty over, over 30 but no where close to fifty...couldnt if i tried. Dont recall going over the line if i did it was fractionally.

thank you for your time, everything is helpful

an interesting aside: the officer didnt call into dispatch to check my license something i have never seen in my limited experience.

[HonkingAntelope]

At least you didn't flunk the attitude test. Unfortunately, you have a pretty tough case and what you want to do depends on how much you are willing to roll the dice. I don't know what kind of prior record you have, but the inability to take traffic school isn't helping any. In other words, you'd have to get lucky to get anything better than getting convicted of both of these violations (OUCH!!!).

If you are willing to eat the conviction for the unsafe speed violation, it may be worthwhile to go to a walk-in session of the traffic court and see the judge without the cop present to try to explain the situation. No guarantees there, but the judge may be willing to drop the left of double yellow charge if you explain the situation right and offer to plead guilty to the speed charge. When it comes to traffic court, your chances depend on the personality of whoever happens to preside over the court that day, but you can still get a good feel for the way things go by going to the court where your case is assigned and watching a couple of traffic sessions.

If you are willing to take a little more risk, Trial by Declaration and, if you lose that, trial de novo would be the way to go.

[powers8989]

thank you very much... excellent info. I currently have no points on my record and nothing worse than 15 over in the past although that was less than 18 months ago. what would i want to emphasize in trial by declaration (could i make things worse for myself?).. and any advice in what to say to the judge in the walk-in? I may have access to a lawyer as well.

again many thanks!

[That Guy]

Well OP, there goes your "saving grace"... I missed the part about the officer not having/using Radar" and HA is correct (good eye HA), if Radar/Laser/Lidar was not used, the prosecution is no obligated to provide an E&T survey...

what would i want to emphasize in trial by declaration (could i make things worse for myself?).. and any advice in what to say to the judge in the walk-in?

Personally, I would stay away from making any statements such as " I dont recall crossing the double yellow, heat of the moment i could have." or "I can tell you i was not going twenty over, over 30 but no where close to fifty...couldnt if i tried. Dont recall going over the line if i did it was fractionally.".... Chances are the judge may read into them as suggesting you were being inattentive... While statements like that will not result in any additional charges, they will likely hurt your chances of a dismissal of one of the violations or a fine reduction (assuming the judge is inclined to consider those options)....

If you have an attorney that can represent you without breaking the bank, you might want to consult with him/her... He she may have a better idea of the local court/judge and can probably help you formulate a suitable plan accordingly. Convictions of both these violations will run you close to $420 or so in fines plus (as HA mentioned) a probable insurance premium hike for a period of 3 years or so...